Any Guess on mutation of my budgie

[atvchick95]

I've been trying to fiqure it out for a while, now people have given me "well it looks like" etc. but I would really like a excat mutation

I know he's pied, and the color is either violet or blue, it looks both depending on how the light hits him

he only has color around his front ''collar" a the rest of his front is white, then he has a patch of color on his back between his wings (where his wings lay down on his back) and one small patch of color on the right side of his "butt" his wings and tail and rest of his body is pure white, his markings on his head and "shoulder"area are grey his cheek patches are a Blueish grey purply color

he was much lighter when I frist got him than he is now, including the lines on his head/shoulders

I was told he could be a Dominate Pied Grey wing, Or a Dominate Pied Spangle - BUT does NOT meet the classifications of a spangle

the only picture i've seen so far that even comes close to him is of a Double Factor Dominate Pied - - - The only differnce between Angel and the pic i found is the color of the markings , in the pic i found they're black and on Angel they're grey

but here's a couple pics I hope some one can help me out here :)

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/RednecksDoItBest/My%20Birds/Angel%20and%20Belle%20Breeding%20Journal/BelleandAngel.jpg



Here's a side view of Angel

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/RednecksDoItBest/My%20Birds/Angel.jpg

[Laura]

I have no idea but he is gorgeous, Bea is pretty good with mutations she might know :) and I believe Kirby is as well if he is still around I think he said he use to bred budgies.

[atvchick95]

:) Thank you

[birdieness]

no spangle for sure. looks like a dom pied grey wing as someone already said. Not sure on color but i'd say cobalt. Grey wing dilutes the body color and he's to dark of a blue compared to my shilo to be a sky. If he didn't have that blue bar on his chest area and had iris ring he would be a Double factor dom pied. He is beautiful. When you shipping them up to me? lol

[huskymom]

I´m no expert and I might just add to the "it looks like" list..

he seems dominant pied, not sure id double factor, as I´ve seen double factor more like reccesive pieds... also he has grey makrings so he could be greywing...

[atvchick95]

no spangle for sure. looks like a dom pied grey wing as someone already said. Not sure on color but i'd say cobalt. Grey wing dilutes the body color and he's to dark of a blue compared to my shilo to be a sky. If he didn't have that blue bar on his chest area and had iris ring he would be a Double factor dom pied. He is beautiful. When you shipping them up to me? lol

he does have iris rings, he's defintaly not a sky blue I've got a normal one and 2 pied opalines and Angel doesnt match that color

when i 1st got him he was a very light violet purple color (like you'd get on a baby outfit or blanket that real light violet)

my camera Doesn't do them justice it's always making them look like a color they're not :( and never seems to show thier iris, I tried for over a hour the other night to get Sunny(my lutino's) iris rings to show up in a picture because they just make him look so evil Red eyes and bright white iris rings. but no matter what setting i used I got Red eyes and nothing else, or nothing but a blur

I attempted to breed him with belle (1st pic) but he's an egg eater :( so i had to remove him, but one of em did something right she ended up having 5 eggs (not counting the 2 he ate) and so far 4 have hatched One should of hatched on the 13th though So i'm thinking its only these 4

[birdieness]

I thought peanut was violet for a while. I'm going to stick with dom pied greywing cobalt. I'm sure bea or Nathan would know for sure as they have bred and owned budgies a lot longer then i.

[Bea]

He's not violet, when violets have some sort of diluting gene they look a beautiful pale lavendar colour.
http://i141.photobucket.com/albums/r78/birdybea/Aviary%20Birds/August72007-aviarybirds013Custom.jpg

I would say your boy is a dominant pied greywing cobalt. :D

[Kirby]

They are stunning! ;) and yup I bred fancy budgies (spangles, true violets [pastel purple colour], cobalts, yf's, recessive pieds, normals, opalines, and cinnamons) for over 8 years. I sure miss my budgies :(

I think that they he is a dominant greying cobalt pied aswell. Then Belle is a light green greywing. Too bad they could not be bred more successfully! :love:

The reason why I think that he is a cobalt is becuase the greywing dilutes the body colour by approx 50%, which explains why you thought he may be a violet (or lighter blue than a cobalt).

He is not a double factor dominant pied (he is 'just' a regular dom pied) becuase DF's have hardly any body colour and/or wing markings. As you can see from your guy, he has medium amount of both wing markings and body colour, which show us that he is a single factor dominant pied ;)

Kirby

[atvchick95]

Thanks they do have babies :D but belle is doing all the work and doing a great job - But angel does feed her through the bars

The reason I'm having such a hard time with his mutation is because the actual wings (when they are out like when he's flying) has nothing no marking at all its just pure plain white

the only markings is up by his neck and on the "shoulders" of his wings I call them shoulders because its the very top of them

and his tail is pure white (everything i read about grey wings said his tail would be grey )

I think my birds just like confusing me LOL

So since he's grey wing and Belle is a full body grey wing - I'd get grey wing babies ?

[birdieness]

Well, most Normal greywings do have grey tails, like my Shilo, but because your bird is a pied the tail is white.

I quite love DF dom pieds. Although i pretty much love any color.

When i went to get shilo it was either her or one exactly like your green girlie. Should have took both lol. SO beautiful!

[atvchick95]

Well, most Normal greywings do have grey tails, like my Shilo, but because your bird is a pied the tail is white.

I quite love DF dom pieds. Although i pretty much love any color.

When i went to get shilo it was either her or one exactly like your green girlie. Should have took both lol. SO beautiful!

thanks - that clears it up, none of the websites i was on said that, it was just for that one mutation, not having the 2 together at the same time LOL

and since i get confused easily I just wasn't understanding it - but now i do :)

[Laura]

Its confusing me as well :p on my end in his picture his tail does not look all white to me not the white like his wings are.

[atvchick95]

that's thanks to my camera but his tail is actually pure white just like his wings and body

If he didn't have the color on his chest, back between his wings and that one little spot on his butt and still had the normal eyes . His mutation would of been a breeze for me LOL he would of been a dark eyed clear LOL he's just as white as my Albino (well when they're not dirty any way lol)

[Kirby]

Yes you will get all greywing babies, in green (so like Belle)... Unless she is split to blue. Green is dominant to blue, so in order to get blue (and green) babies, both parents need the blue gene. As the male is a visual (he already clearly has the blue gene) it is up to Belle to be split to blue.

50% of the babies (usually) will be dominant pied aswell. And you *may* get other colours such as opaline, cinnamon, lutino, albino, and recessive pied. This is possible becuase cinny, opaline, lutino, and albino are sex linked genes from the dad, so he if is split to any of those mutations, you could get daughters (only) in those colours. Both parents would have to be split to recessive pied in order to get recessive pieds, but either way you will be getting dominant pieds (guaranteed as dad is visual).

I hope I didn't confuse you ;)

Kirby

[Kirby]

ps- Birdieness, I am 95% sure that Shilo is a dilute opaline hehe not a greywing.

Kirby

[birdieness]

ps- Birdieness, I am 95% sure that Shilo is a dilute opaline hehe not a greywing.

Kirby
Whoa, thats new to me, I've had a Dilute before (RIP Jay) and he Was Beautiful but nothing like Shilo even tho he was a grey. Here's some pics

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/Flockphotos/Budgie/December%2007/PICCIES297.jpg

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/Flockphotos/Budgie/December%2007/PICCIES346.jpg

http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa143/Flockphotos/Budgie/January%2008/PICCIES434.jpg

No real amazing pictures of her, She really hates the camera

[Kirby]

she is very cute :love: and SCREAMS out dilute opaline to me ;) I am not 100% sure though, only 95% hehe

Kirby

[atvchick95]

I see the opaline :D

but the whole dilute confuses me, I have a Yellow Face violet cinnamon (2 acutally same parents differnt clutch) and they're both the lightest pretties violet and both lighter then the rest of thier clutch mates but i just assumed the cinnamon made them lighter on body color


oh and before i forget the explaination of what thier (now 5) babies should be mutation wise didn't confuse me at all I actually understood it :D

[Kirby]

Im glad you understood it :) I tried to keep it basic hehe.

Do you have pics of these yf violet cinnamons? Cinnamon does lighten/change the colour a tad bit... but not too drastically. I'd love to see them!

Kirby :)

[atvchick95]

Keep in mind my camera doesn't take very good quaility pictures When you look at her in person she is a very light violet (actually purple even know my camera makes her look blue), and she does have cinnamon wings - i'm hoping this yr santa brings me a really good camera :)

my camera even messes up colors on clothes, I'd taken a pic of my daughter wearing a beautiful purple sweater it came out looking periwinkle, I have one with my son wearing a bright head sweat shirt it looks like a brick red or marron :(

but here is Zoey She's the 1st yf cinnamon violet of sky and violet I'll have to get some decent pics of the one from the 2nd clutch, She's always squishing under her siblings when she see's a camera LOL

oh and Zoey's Cere is now white instead of the pinky blue it used to be she's only 3 1/2 months old and her nest mate Jessie who's the same age her cere is already turning brown


http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/RednecksDoItBest/My%20Birds/010-3.jpg

[Kirby]

She is a yellow face cinnamon opaline :love: I do not think she is violet though, as we said earlier, the cinnamon is what changed the colour a bit. Violets are purple, she is more lilac/blue... but still very gorgeous! ;)

Kirby

[atvchick95]

i thought she might be opaline as well

but honestly in real life she looks purple just like her brothers/sisters from both clutches

I'll have to see if i can borrow some one's camera one of these days that has one that takes decent pictures and get some good pictures of them.

her mom is a Violet (with a white face) her dad is a Sky blue (with a white face) but with thier clutches i've found out he's Also Split to yellow face, Opaline and Cinnamon

[Kirby]

Umm... budgies can't be split to yf :blush: lol. It's not possible... haha.

So either one of them is a light (pale) yf or the mom got bred by another male (your yf male) by accident when you werent watching, or something lol.

He *can* be split to cinny and opaline though, which shows us that this bub above is for sure a hen :)

Kirby

[atvchick95]

hmmm I was told he or both him and her were split to yellow face, They were paired together for a few months no other male got to her I'm sure of that

here are Zoey's parents

thier faces are dirty from eating birdy bread normally they're pretty and white

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/RednecksDoItBest/My%20Birds/055.jpg


oh and the only other yellow face I had at the time he was a yellow face violet (he's recently passed on) was in a cage with his yellow face violet mate and they'd been together since the day i got them back in Nov. 07 never let out with the other birds

[Kirby]

They are very cute parents :love: But I actually cannot work it out. Having a budgie split to yf would be like having a female tiel being split to pearl, lutino, or cinnamon... it just does not, and can never happen :wacko: Something is wrong with that breeding (in the sense a yf was bred form 2 wf parents).... someone is hiding something from us lol

Kirby

[atvchick95]

oo you think that one is odd - those 2 yellow face violet pairs i mentioned that were in a cage from nov 07 up until just a couple weeks ago

had thier 1st clutch - only 2 hatched one lived - he has the normal "white" face but he is violet

I still haven't fiqured that one out If yellow face is supposed to be dominate and both parents were in fact yellow face how come the baby wasn't LOL


kinda irks me that they're not actually split to yellow face now i gotta go changing all my records - I was told by some one who I thought really knew thier genetics and budgies since they always answer mutation questions and i haven't seen them be wrong yet :(

[Bea]

I believe that if you breed two yf budgies you can get a whiteface, but that it can then have yf babies. I'm sure i've heard of this before.

For example, if we pair a single factor mutant 1 Yellowface to a whiteface then we will theoretically produce 50% yellowfaces and 50% whitefaces. When pairing two single factor mutant 1 yellowfaces together the results will be 50% single factor Yellowface, 25% double factor Yellowface and 25% whitefaces. Of course the double factor mutant 1 is in fact a whiteface too in appearance as mentioned earlier; so here we have 50% whitefaces of which half are in fact yellowfaces and only by test mating one can establish which of the two it is. Pairing this whitefaced (double factor Yellowface) to another whiteface with no Yellowface in the background will result 100% single factor yellowfaces.
http://www.bestofbreeds.net/al-nasser/article12.htm

[atvchick95]

ooo ok, that makes sense