New/ways to convert my bird to pellets and fresh food

[hilary]

Hi there, my name's Hilary. I'm new here and I have a few questions.

I've had my tiel, Sweetie, for seven years now. I feel awful that I haven't tried my best to switch her to a mix of pellet/seed diet sooner. I've tried mixing in pellets gradually and she's pretty picky she has just picked them up and dropped them in the past. I've also tried cooked pasta with some other veggies I found on a safe veggie list for cockatiels and she didn't touch it. I'd just like some advice as to how to introduce these foods (how much at a time, what I should try first, etc)?

Also, I was looking through the photos of cages on the site and I noticed most people have taller vs. wider cages for the majority. I have a wide and short cage, is this not okay? If I had enough money right now I'd get her this one (http://www.birdcages.com/small-bird-cages/flight-cage/havanaflightcage.cfm)that I saw on another thread. Maybe I will soon when I get some more money babysitting.

Also, would more toys be a good idea? I feel like if I had too many more it'd be crowded. Suggestions once again would be great.

Here's a picture of her current cage tell me what you think. I'm going to get her a variety of new perches soon after seeing other people's cages on this site. I think I'll get a rope one, and some new wood ones. I've read on here that facing them from front to back vs. side to side is better for them to spread their wings, would this be possible in a cage my size?

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b234/hilary_2010/IMG_0001-3.jpg

Thanks so much! Sorry I have so many questions, I just want to do what's best for my girl. Here she is:
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b234/hilary_2010/Dillan%20and%20Daisy/coookiesandcake011.jpg

[Raven2322]

Wow, Sweetie is really pretty. :) I use to have a similar cage when I only had one cockatiel and I've always heard if you have a tall cage they mainly stay at the top. I have a similar flight cage to the one you posted and that's what mine do a lot. I think more perches is a great idea. Some more toys couldn't hurt. If you're worried about crowding her you can always buy a number or different toys and rotate them every week. I find a combination of different toys works for my birds, preening, shreading, shinny ones, and bells, foraging toys, etc. Have you tried brocolli? Mine love it plain and uncooked and every bird I've ever had will eat it. Also, I when I converted my 17 year old to pellets, I put them in a seperate dish and he thought they were a treat and so he ate them. I also mixed them for a while and given the choice he mainly ate seeds, so I just switched him competly, it made him a little annoyed at first but he knew the pellets were food and so he ate them. you could try only put seed in for so long and just pellets the rest of the time. I don't actually feed regular seed anymore at all I feed Avicakes (seed & pellet combo) or nutriberries as a seed treat. Have you tried different flavors of pellets? I ask because my 17 year old Aladdin, was ok with zupreem fruit, but I got him wild and spicy and I can't get his out of the dish. :) So she might like a different flavor better or brand. Hope I gave you some ideas. Good luck, and welcome to TC. :D

[twig braker]

i think your cage is fine, but it never hurts to change the toys and purches every now and then. i have never herd of anything bad about cages that are more wide than tall so i think you are fine with that one, but i could be wrong so wait for someone else to have input. though if you want to get the new cage go for it.

as for getting them to eat veggies, i was lucky with petrie he just ate everything in site so it was easy to get him eating all kinds of stuff. but i think one of the keys to getting them to eat new foods is to have a good bond so that they either really like you and just want to do/eat everything you do/eat. or that they trust you enough to know what you are feeding them is not going to harm them. along with that just be consistent in offering them food, do not force them to eat (holding it in their face) be patient let them get used to it unpressured. eat with them (set up a bench next to table or something) i think this helps because when your eating they will probably think whatever you put infront of them is ok to eat. keep trying:D

[hilary]

Thanks for quick replies Kristin and twig braker! I'll be using your suggestions with rotating/adding more toys and switching up the branches.

I haven't tried broccoli yet, but I will do that. I'm gonna go grocery shopping for Sweetie tomorrow I think, maybe tonight, and get her a variety of foods I've read are popular with tiels. I have corn in the freezer as well as peas so I think I'll give those a try with maybe some whole wheat pasta.

The pellets I tried for Lafebers (sp?). That's a good idea, I've read great things about the Zupreem fruit brand of pellets, so I think I'll pick those up. Or maybe the "wild and spicy" Kristin mentioned. I'll be persistent with the pellets and hopefully I can eliminate seed to only a treat. Thanks again!

Oh, and another question. Do any of you guys have those seed catcher things to go around the cage? I hate vacuuming so much around the cage and was wondering if they help at all.

[twig braker]

no i dont, but what really helps is putting food dishes closer to the bottom. worked for me, also there is food dishes that have a cover thing over the top, im sure they help i little bit. sorry i tryed looking for some pictures but i couldnt find any of the food dishes with covers around them, but do you know what i am talking about? this cage has them in it if you can see

[Raven2322]

I think Lafeber is a really good brand, my birds all love it, I might try their pellets in the future. I know I mentioned wild and spicy zupreem. My cockatiels also eat the following zupreem pellets: Fruit blend,Garden goodness, Harvest feast, wild & spicy, and Natural diet. As for seed guards the only thing I've ever used was a roll of plastic I bought at petco it had velcro attachments and you put it around the lower half of the cage, it was ok. I know petco and petsmart sell cage gaurds that kind of look like a fabric nets, you might want to take a look. I don't bother with guard because they will get around it somehow. I don't put food lower in my flight cage because then they would poop in it and a lot would get wasted. You could try putting less in the dish and changing more often. I've heard if they feel they have less, they will eat more and throw away less. Or like Twig breaker said lots of places sell covered dishes. If you can't find ones that fit your door you can find ones that attached to the side of the cage. You could even try a silo style feeder, I have that for my smaller birds and it works great. Something else I tried to get my cockatiels to eat more veggie, was to put them out when they are out of there cage as a treat, this seemed to work better than in their cage with the normal food. Also, I recently tried using a food processor to mash everything I gave them and they really loved that a lot. All 5 of them tried most of everything I put out. Good luck with Sweetie.

[olive juice]

Aww, she's so beautiful. :)

Your story and mine are pretty similar, actually. I've had Halley for seven years too, and also felt terrible about not giving him a proper diet. I thought I had the most stubborn bird ever on my hands, trust me - I thought it would take ages and ages for him to eat vegetables - but it happened faster than I ever could have imagined.

I'll share with you what I did.

I used the recipe and method found here on the Seven Layer Salad: http://www.aviannetwork.com/articles/salad.htm but tweaked it a little. My salad is set up like this:
Layer 1) Leafy greens. Echo likes them, but Halley doesn't, so to avoid waste I usually buy beets with the greens attached on the top. (They both like beets.)
Layer 2) Broccoli and peppers. They both like green peppers, but I've found red peppers add some color and therefore make the whole mix look better, so they end up eating more.
Layer 3) Greenbeans. I like to use greenbeans because the birds like them and, again, it cuts down on waste. I don't have to buy whole bundles of veggies where most of them will be thrown out; I can buy greenbeans a handful at a time.
Layer 4) Beets. Again, this adds color, and they're sweet so Sweetie may like them. The beet juice gets their feathers a little messy, but personally I find it adorable. :p
Layer 5) Oranges. Cockatiels usually aren't big on fruit, but mine seem to like the oranges enough. They also add an acidic quality that keeps the veggies fresher longer.
Layer 6) Frozen mixed vegetables. My mixes usually include peas and corn. Echo loves the peas, even though Halley doesn't touch them.

Every single morning and every single evening I presented Halley with the salad, in a separate dish from his seeds. For a few days, he didn't touch it, but I kept on. I let him watch me prepare the food, I would say things like, "Ooh, Halley, are you ready? This is gonna be so yummy!" to make him interested. (I still do this today, in fact, just because. :p) I would let him see me taste some (and make a big deal out of how good it was) before giving it to him. He still wouldn't touch it, until I let him see me sprinkle some millet on top. Then, finally, he approached the dish.

At first, he only ate the seeds out. But one day, he tried the veggies, and now he loves them. He still prefers seeds over anything else, but he'll readily gobble up veggies too. Broccoli, green beans, and green and red peppers are his favorites.

What you have to do, most importantly, is BE PERSISTENT. Be just as stubborn as Sweetie is going to be. The second thing is: add variety. Try a lot of different things. That's what is good about the salad technique; there's so much variety already included in the mix, that Sweetie will get curious before long and try some. She may not like everything presented to her, so present a lot...before long, you'll know what her favorites are. The third thing to keep in mind is: presentation matters. Try chopping the veggies in different ways: whole pieces, big pieces, minced pieces. Cubes, strips, circles. Try food-processing them. (Halley likes his veggies in bigger pieces, while Echo won't eat them unless they're chopped very small.)

And just remember...you're going to waste a lot of food at first. And it's okay. With patience, Sweetie will be eating fresh food before you know it. :)

I wish I could help you as far as pellets go...but honestly, Halley refused them all along, until one day he just started eating them. Again, seeds are his preference, so I have to actively limit those. I have four separate dishes for both my birds: one for seed, which I give in the evenings; one for pellets, which is always available to them; one for fresh food, which I offer twice daily for 2 hours (don't leave fresh food in the cage longer than this or it can spoil); and one for water which of course is always available.

Anyways, I didn't mean to write you a novel, but good luck! :D

[hilary]

Wow thank you all so so much! You've all been so helpful, I'm so glad I joined this forum. I'll try out the layered salad and be persistent like you've all suggested. I'm actually boiling some eggs right now to see if Sweetie will try those. I've heard of mash, and I know olive juice mentioned you've food processed the food so I'll try mixing some egg and veggies in and see if she likes small pieces, large, or mashed, etc. Thank you so much olive juice, you were a big help along with everyone else here. I'll keep you all updated on Sweetie's progress, hopefully not lack thereof!


Raven and twig, I can see it in the picture, and now that I'm thinking more about it I figure what the heck, I'll just deal with vacuuming, it'll get out somehow I'm sure. Thanks for all the different types of Zupreem your bird like Raven, I think I'll get the fruit one first and give it a try and if not try another after a while.

[sweetrsue]

I ordered a book about running an exotic bird shelter and they switch their birds to pellets this way. No seed is left in the cage overnight. Pellets are always available. In the morning fresh foods are offered. Only in the afternoon or evening are seeds made available and only for an hour or two. This way you know you won't starve your bird and she will start to try what she has available to her. I find that if seed is available all the time they quickly revert back to a preference for seed.

[hilary]

I ordered a book about running an exotic bird shelter and they switch their birds to pellets this way. No seed is left in the cage overnight. Pellets are always available. In the morning fresh foods are offered. Only in the afternoon or evening are seeds made available and only for an hour or two. This way you know you won't starve your bird and she will start to try what she has available to her. I find that if seed is available all the time they quickly revert back to a preference for seed.

This sounds great, I will be giving it a try. Now, since she hasn't had fresh foods successfully yet, and I'm only starting out trying to give her them tonight, should I wait to do the seed to pellet switch until after she's comfortable with fresh foods? I don't know if doing both at once would overwhelm her?

[sweetrsue]

There's no reason why you can't start switching her with the method I described now. If you pussyfoot around it will only take longer to switch her to a healthier diet. I know your soft hearted but remember 'tiels only eat about 2 tablespoons of food a day. So she will get enough seed in the hour or two that you have it in her cage. Be Brave! You can do it!

[hilary]

Okay, I will now then. Thanks so much sweetrsue!

[olive juice]

You're very welcome. :)

Oh, I should add that Halley didn't like the first kind of pellets I offered him. They were eXact brand I believe, and fruit-colored/shaped. He wouldn't swallow a bit of them. But when I got Echo, her breeder gave me a sample bag of Roudybush mini pellets, and Halley likes these. So yeah, experimentation is needed with the pellets too. :)

You could do one switch at a time, but no matter what you should take Sweetie to an avian vet at some point during this transition. About halfway through the switch, I took Halley to an avian vet and it was a really good thing I did. Because of the stress of the new foods, there was a yeast build-up in his body (as discovered through a gram stain with his poop). He wasn't sick, he was actually surprisingly healthy for a bird who had lived on only seeds, but too much yeast can lead to problems if left untreated. I gave him the proper medicine and two weeks later he was fine. He displayed no symptoms of being ill, other than occasional "strain" to go to the bathroom. So yeah, after a few weeks of Sweetie eating the new foods, you should take her to a vet and make sure she's coping with things all right.

And, like sweetrsue said, sometimes you do need to restrict the amount of seeds given to your bird. Halley and Echo both choose seeds over their other foods, so I have to take it out to get them to be interested in their veggies or pellets.

[hilary]

Oh, very good idea, I'll take her to the vet once she's been on the new diet for a bit. That's scary that happened with Halley, but I'm glad he was okay! I put a smaller version of the layered salad in her cage (havent gone food shopping yet) with chopped swiss chard on the bottom, green bell pepper and carrots, corn and peas, and on top cooked egg with its shell mashed. I sprinkled it with millet like you suggested. It was the cutest thing to watch her stick her head out being all curious about it. Finally she got up the nerve to get on the perch next to the dish and taste a bit. I'm pretty sure she only got the millet, but thats okay. It's a good step for the first time. I'll try again in the morning and I'm leaving the dish in for another hour and then I'll take it out tonight.

I think I'll do what sweetrsue said and take out the seed completely during fresh food time, because after she nibbled at the food she went over to the floor where I had put her seed dish. And I'll also take out the seed and put pellets in 24/7 once I get some new ones tomorrow and put the seed in for 1-2 hours a day like sue said.

Thanks again for your help!

[sweetrsue]

Mine wouldn't touch the Kaytee exact pellets either they went for Zupreem fruitblend but the had weird colored poops. To my surprise they like the Zupreem natural diet just as well.

[olive juice]

That does sound like a really good start. At least she's not petrified of the dish like Halley was. ;)

I would keep an eye on her droppings during this switch. Change the papers on the bottom of her cage every day, and count the droppings before you do. Make sure she's still pooping about the same amount, and make sure the droppings look normal (consistency mostly, as color will change depending on what she eats). Poop means she's eating. It's not a bad idea to buy a gram scale and keep an eye on her weight too, though I didn't do that with Halley.

[hilary]

I'll definitely keep an eye and count when I change the newspaper daily. I wouldn't want her to get sick from me trying to make her healthy!

[srtiels]

So she might like a different flavor better or brand. Hope I gave you some ideas. Good luck, and welcome to TC.

When you are unsure of which pellets your tiel will like, you can call each manufacturer, talk to customer service and ask if they can send you a sample of each. They ususally do this no charge. This way you can present alittle of each in a small dish and see which brand they prefer.

I have found that when introducing anything new I will use a small dish and place it at the bottom of the cage. Tiels are ground feeders, and curious and in 'foraging' they will taste whatever is available.

As to diet, variety is the way to go a...and also free choice...meaning place dishes of seeds and pellets. Somedays they will eat more of one than the other.

As to you cage...width is better than height. A tiel will get more excercise going back and forth, rather than up and down.

As to veggie...everyone had some GREAT suggestions. The only thing I would like to add is that if you give any leafy green try a whole leaf, not chopped up. A tiel will instinctively nibble on the areas of the leaf that have the most nutrients...which is the veins. It may not look like they ate it, because it is not all eaten, by if you carefully look you will see little holes all over the leaf where they selected the part they felt had the best nutrients.

As to eggs or any perishable food, when chopped this leaves more areas exposed...thus they go bad quicker. Offer the veggies/etc. for a short period of time...maybe a couple of hours at the most. Once the tiel gets used to eating the greens/etc. as they're placed in the cage, used this as a guide on how soon to remove the excess.

Susanne

[hilary]

Great thanks so much Susanne. I actually chopped up the leafy greens this morning but for tonight and everytime on I'll try leaving them whole and hopefully Sweetie likes them that way. That's an awesome idea about the pellets, cause I'm not too excited to get a whole bunch and have her not like them and prefer another, even though thats just part of the process. I'll try that out before buying.

[srtiels]

Thanks,

Most of the pellet companies are very nice to work with when you are considering using pellets. I have done the same thing when I wanted to try various handfeeding formulas. It sure saves investing in alot of product that they will not eat. Your tiel may like a couple of different types...then you can alternate days with each brand.

Good Luck :)...Susanne

[hilary]

Awesome, I'll be calling soon to hopefully get some samples of zupreem pellets.

[hilary]

Update: I know it's only been a day since I introduced the pellets/fresh food but I think Sweetie is making improvement. I gave her seed for only an hour or two yesterday in the late afternoon to make sure she's eating something at least, and I've had the pellets in her cage the whole time since then (also when I take her out and put her on per playgym on top of the cage I put the pellet dish up there. I've seen her take a few bites of the pellets a couple times while in the cage, and once or twice while outside of the cage. I think I still need to give her seeds but I'm glad shes tasting them at least. The fresh food, well the first time was the best because she at least tried it (mostly ate the millet on top) but now she's afraid of it I think. I baked her some birdy bread but she has yet to try it. I'm sticking with it though! She'll come around eventually :p

[olive juice]

She will come around. Trust me, Halley's afraid of his own shadow, but he gobbles up veggies like a pro now. :)

[hilary]

Haha how cute :D

[sweetrsue]

I still give my birds both seeds and pellets. It is actually necessary for them to have SOME fat in their diet to be able to process calcium effectively.

[hilary]

I still give my birds both seeds and pellets. It is actually necessary for them to have SOME fat in their diet to be able to process calcium effectively.

Good to know, thank you!

[olive juice]

Oh, and another question. Do any of you guys have those seed catcher things to go around the cage? I hate vacuuming so much around the cage and was wondering if they help at all.
I only just saw this question, hehe.
Halley doesn't have one of those seed-catcher things, and I wish he did because Echo does and her area is much neater than his. It does seem to help quite a lot. Also, Halley has a cover thing over his dish, and that cut down a lot on the mess he'd make. He can't quite throw his seeds/pellets around in the same way now, hah.

[hilary]

I only just saw this question, hehe.
Halley doesn't have one of those seed-catcher things, and I wish he did because Echo does and her area is much neater than his. It does seem to help quite a lot. Also, Halley has a cover thing over his dish, and that cut down a lot on the mess he'd make. He can't quite throw his seeds/pellets around in the same way now, hah.

Haha you may have just changed my mind on getting one. I saw those covered types of dishes and they seem like they'd help like you said. Sweetie is eating her pellets some! I'm still giving her seed, and I think I always will as a treat (and for now to make sure she's getting all the food she needs) but Sweetie is at least taking interest in the pellets. Yesterday she was eating them and then she started almost attacking the dish and spraying them everywhere! Definitely would've been a good time for a seed catcher haha.

[braveheartdogs]

Hi there,

I just tried something new with my baby cockatiel Feather that was really helpful. I have had her 3 weeks. I immediately started her on Lafeber pellets (she was weaned on seeds, but was offered pellets too). I keep pellets in there all the time, but give her a few squares of Avicakes in the afternoons. The pellets don't ever really look dusty like she has been eating them, which worries me.

I have been giving her a dish full of different things like hard boiled eggs, cut up apple pieces, a veggie mix of corn, peas and little carrot pieces as well as parsley and carrot tops hung in her cage. She doesn't seem to try to much in her dish, but does like corn and peas. But, I wanted to encourage her to try some other stuff also.

So, today, I put her on my desk and laid some things out for her. I put a few tiny bits of hard boiled egg, a cheerio and a few pellets. She LOVED the egg which she hadn't even tried before. She liked the cheerio too and she even tried the pellets. She is baby bird and so she is curious and likes to explore, so I think putting things out there really encouraged her to try it. You might try that! I'm not sure if it would work as well for an adult, but I might try it with one of my older birds.

Vicki

[olive juice]

^ Birds are always naturally curious, but the older a bird gets, the more set in its ways it gets.
The good news is that once you attune an older bird to new foods, it is far more likely to try new foods that you offer it.
Halley is far, FAR more adventurous when it comes to food. Today I offered him something new for the first time: cauliflower, sweet potato, hard boiled egg with the shell, and carrots all food processed into a mash. I sprinkled seeds on top just to get him interested, and before long he was gobbling it up. Six months ago if I'd tried that, he wouldn't have touched it.
But yes, it is much easier to introduce new things to a younger bird, and not just food either, but toys, perches, games, whistles, baths, etc etc.

[braveheartdogs]

^ Birds are always naturally curious, but the older a bird gets, the more set in its ways it gets.
The good news is that once you attune an older bird to new foods, it is far more likely to try new foods that you offer it.
Halley is far, FAR more adventurous when it comes to food. Today I offered him something new for the first time: cauliflower, sweet potato, hard boiled egg with the shell, and carrots all food processed into a mash. I sprinkled seeds on top just to get him interested, and before long he was gobbling it up. Six months ago if I'd tried that, he wouldn't have touched it.
But yes, it is much easier to introduce new things to a younger bird, and not just food either, but toys, perches, games, whistles, baths, etc etc.

I totally agree that younger birds are more curious, but with Feather, I think it was that it was not in her dish that made the difference. She seems to enjoy "discovering" things and I think because she just found it (of course I put it there for her to find) she seemed more interested.

Vicki

[olive juice]

^ Yeah, foraging helps, since birds are natural foragers. :)
Halley will only eat certain things (like plain sweet potato) off my plate, not out of his dish. Echo is the same way with certain veggies and bread. In fact, how I first got echo to try veggies was by presenting them to her on a plate.

[hilary]

Thanks for all the tips. I think I'll try giving her some different types of food off a plate or the kitchen table where she usually hangs out with me. I tried it with a few rice krispies and she loved those (of course as only a treat since they're sugary). Hopefully she'll try the birdie bread I made that way too, although I tried it before and she ignored it. I think she has to be in the mood to try new food for her to try it haha.