# Peritonitis?



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

Anyone ever dealt with this? From what the vet said, egg yolk got into my female cockatiel's abdomen, and became infected. We think we caught it early, so she's (not easily) taking an antibiotic, metacam for the swelling, and something in her water to help her liver out.

She's eating, pooping, and acting otherwise normally...but I know birds don't show illness, so I'm still being very cautious.

Has anyone ever had a bird go through this? Only on day 1 of treatment, hopefully the hormone shot she got and the extra meds will help her kick this. Keeping the temp around 82, humidity at 65, and she's eating her seed, pellets, millet and brown rice.

She really loathes the antibiotic though, not a fan of being wrapped up and force fed from the syringe.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I have dealt with peritonitis in the past and the ONLY real effective antibiotic is pipercillin, which is injectable. 

I have heard too many bad things about metacam. Do an internet search on side effects and reactions to this med.

What type of lighting do you have. A hen that is suseptable to peritonitis would benefit from dailly access to real sunlight (not filtered thru glass) or a fullspectrum light hung above the cage. Lighting can eliminate so many female reproductive problems.

What was he situation prior to this problem? Meaning...set up for breeding, chronic layer, etc?


----------



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

She's single, just lays from time to time. At my parents house (I travel alot, so they have been keeping her) she gets lots of sunlight. Here, she doesn't get very much at all...

So baytril is what the vet gave me, is it not good?


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Baytril is fine, but it won't get all of the infection. You'll wind up with a hen that will continually have ascites...which is fluid retention in the abdomen, that has to be drained off. Did the vet draw any fluid out of her abdomen?

In addition to Baytril the injectable form of Pipercillin is more effective.


----------



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

She drained off a little, but couldn't hit a big "pocket" of it. She didn't get much, just enough to see what was going on...tried three times from what I was told.

So there's still an egg sized lump, but no mention of the other drug. Should I ask about it? This particular vet has an awful bedside manner, and I'm not entirely sure she'd be willing to entertain someone second guessing her prescriptions...

Should this regime (baytril, metacam, and calorad in her water) be enough to get her over it initially?

She goes back for a check in thursday, and then again on monday.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

So there's still an egg sized lump, but no mention of the other drug
-----------------------------------------------------------------

The first pix is ascites...which is fluids seen under the skin. The 2nd pix is an extreme case of peritonitis...which the skin is yellowed because it is excreting some of the yolk out of the body thru the skin. Peritonitis can be caused by an infection in the follicles (3rd pix) or from a yolk that misses the funnel into the oviduct and travels into the body cavity. The yolk is sterile, and when in the abdominal cavity fluid starts to build up. This can remain sterile for a time with no prblem, but as the yolk degrades bacteria builds up and them it becomes septic...which means that harmful bacteria is in the contents and can g=be absorbed into the bloodstream and can result in death. peritonitis is more common than egg binding. many people assume their hens died off egg binding when in reality it was peritonitis. A hen can appear fine one day and just be ded the nest.

Treatment is difficult because in addition to antibiotics the fluid has to be drawn off. This is invasive and if care is not done the needle can nick tissue or organs inside the hen (4th pix) and cass infection in addition to the peritonitis. This is why Pipercillin is so important. It is the BEST antibiotic for internal infections like what is going on with youe hen.

All of the above pix are from birds I have lost due to peritonitis over the years,...I attened the necropsys to understand what happened inside.


----------



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

looks more like the first picture...how long is the recovery time generally? I'm worried now I need to get her on additional meds, but I Seriously doubt the vet will just say okay, and give them to me...


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

OK....If your pix looks like the first one it is not as serious. Is the vet you have an avian vet? And if so, do you have any other avian vets in your area? 

Many times with ascites (you can do an internet search for more info on this) you will need something to act as a duiretic to help her to get fluids out of her system. I haven't dealt with it in quite awhile, but Lasix (lasex, not sure of spelling) was used...OR from the health food store, a herbal extract...Dandelion, can be added to the water. If she will eat dandelion greens that will help too.

Ususally if a vet draws fluid out of the body it is ususally between 5-10cc at a time. This is why the baytril was prescribed, because it was an invasive precedure, and to safe guard about a secondary infection due to this.

The Pipercillin, which the current brand is ZOSYN is only in injectable form and is a combination of Pipercillin and Tazobactam

Once on the injectable (vet would have to show how to do shots), which I beleive can be 2 or 3 times a day for 7-10 days will quickly act on the infection. With the injectable I have had recovery from the infection within a week.


----------



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

yes, this vet is a certified avian vet...one of two close to me, the other is a little farther away. She said she didn't get as much fluid out as she had hoped, and there are no diuretics involved to my knowledge


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Thats great it was an avian vet. Did she give you an idea of when to come back for a followup visit. It may be needed to draw more fluids out. Or you can phone and ask her about a diuretic and about the Pipercillin.


----------



## Andrewmham (Jun 7, 2010)

I take her back on thursday, and then again on monday....currently trying to give her meds on my own with the syringes. She's not having any of that, this morning she probably only got 1/2 of her baytril dose...she squirms like crazy.

I sure hope they try for more fluid, should I ask about a diuretic and the pipercillin?


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

That is great that your vet had scheduled the follow-up visits. The vet sounds like an attentive vet, whereas some vets would just see the bird, prescribe drugs, and your out the door and on your own, with no follow-up. On your next visit I would suggest asking about the pipercillin.

I hate giving meds orally because there is a great risk of aspirating the bird, and also if they are spitting some out they are not getting enough in them for theraputer levels to be effective. If you are not squeemish I would suggest that you ask the vet about doing injections. Baytril is also available in the injectable form. 

Also, watch her droppings. As she starts to pass some of the fluid in the abdomen the dropping may get a slightly slimy look to them. And the skin of the abdomen is another exit point for the yolk and it can start to get thickened and yellow/orangish looking.


----------



## bird brain (May 30, 2010)

If you caught it early enough then it may not be necessary to perform surgery to remove all the fluid. As long as you keep going with the meds, keeping her warm, good diet etc. she should do fine. I'm not sure about the metacam, I think it can be iffy if the bird has dodgy kidneys or liver, they can't cope with it. The baytril should be fine, but I have also heard of the use of piperacillin for peritonitis. The baytril was probably given over the piperacillin because it can be given orally. The treatment I have heard is antibiotics and steroids.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

If you caught it early enough then it may not be necessary to perform surgery to remove all the fluid.
----------------------------

Surgery is not needed to remove the fluids. I large bore needle attached to a 10-20cc syringe is carefully inserted into the abdomen and the fluid is drawn out. Antibiotics such as baytril are used as a precaution just in case the needle came in contact with any tissue or organs. But with peritonitis treatment several a couple of antibiotics used in conjunction are the most effective.


----------



## bird brain (May 30, 2010)

Yes you're right I don't know why I said that lol. All I meant was that if you get it early enough the meds, diet, warmth etc. may be enough (from what I've read anyway, I've never experienced it personally), don't know where surgery came into it.


----------

