# Please help me find out the gender of this pair



## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Hi all,
Can any1 tell me where is the male,and where female?
They are 1,5 years old but I never see they mating ,shoud I put the nest box for them?
And can I coupling the grey cockatiel with lutino?






Thanks all,


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

theyre both boys


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## Debbie05 (Feb 9, 2010)

Yes both boys.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

It looks like the same bird in both pix's, which he is a normal grey male.

You mentioned a lutino...do you have another bird?


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

DallyTsuka said:


> theyre both boys


Really? ( That's why I never see them have another friendly gesture ever...

Thank you DallyTsuka,but can you tell me how could you find out? I want to buy another one to coupling,but don't know how to choose....

btw,can I coupling the grey with lutino?


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## 4birdsNC (Dec 4, 2010)

In the first picture it looks like there is a second gray tiel behind the one centered in the picture... both pictures of of a male Grey split to Whiteface. I dont see any barring on the tail feathers of the other bird so it would be a male also.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

srtiels said:


> It looks like the same bird in both pix's, which he is a normal grey male.


No,I confirmed that there're 2 diffirent birds.



srtiels said:


> You mentioned a lutino...do you have another bird?


No,I don't,I just want to know if I can coupling the grey with lutino so that I can buy a female lutino.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

yes, you can pair a grey and a lutino. with these two, males have bright yellow faces, but lutinos are tricky.

best way to find out with a lutino is to ask about the parents. if the mother was NOT a lutino then the lutino baby would be a female.

also, bit hard to see but if the bird is over a year old and has faint yellow stripes on its tail, the bird is female.


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## Conurekidd (May 16, 2011)

Male normals and white faces will have a complete diffrent facial change in color. Females will hold the Grey face with yellow suffussed into facial area. Mostly around the beak. 
Males bave the all yellow face like yours Same with white faces. Males have a white face and females have a grey.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Thank you all for your help!

Seems the lutino is hard to find out their gender,so I will buy another grey cockatiel with grey face as Conurekidd mentioned.

Should I pair them as soon as I get a female or keep each of them in diffrent cage for a few days?

And about the nest box,can I use the carton box instead of wood?


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

keep in mind, the way to tell if that grey tiel is a female is if its older than a year for sure... grey tiels all look like females when babies so look for a bird older than a year.

i would wait, 30 days in separate cage in a different room if you can...

also, wood is better, but you CAN use card board... though they may chew it and can cause some problems. so in the end, wood is better.

theres also other colours that are easy to sex that would be good to pair with a grey,

pearl females have lovely spots. i have a pearl female (in my signature). the females keep the spots, males lose them and look like grey males. if older than a year, which is what you are looking for to breed, a female pearl will have the spots.

pieds are hard to sex so it may be best to avoid it.

but i think since your males are split whiteface, a whitefaced hen would be good. whiteface hens dont have the orange spot. they're all grey with a little bit of white in the face. if older than a year a female will look like that. if male, they get an all white mask. but if you pair your grey with a whiteface female, you can get some whitefacce babies instead of all grey.

this is a female whiteface
http://www.cockatielsplusparrots.com/images/Sandra.Trottier-Whiteface.hen650x615.500x473.jpg

and this is a male
http://ih0.redbubble.net/work.5880777.4.flat,550x550,075,f.wow-white-face-cockatiel-nz-southland.jpg


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## Conurekidd (May 16, 2011)

Yes sorry I forgot to mention babies all appear female until 1 to 2 succsessful molts. I'd say a wf hen would be best as well. Consider that your boys split the gene. You can possibly result in an all wf offspring. But you might find a grey. 
Thanks for clearing this up dally.


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## Tez54 (May 12, 2011)

I would have them in different cages for about a week, but near enough other so they can see each other and see how they respond, as for the nest box, most definitely a wood one as they chew and will easily get out of the carton. make sure the female is over 1 year old and apart from the barring on the tail feathers they will also have spots under their wings, and the females are not as vocal as the males, maybe you should get a book on Cockatiels or look them up on the internet you can get lots of advise from there.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

hey, you got good input too  just adding onto what you posted 

but yes, i agree a whiteface female whether is a normal whiteface hen or a whiteface pearl, whiteface cinnamon.... so long as its a whiteface hen of any variety, they would get whiteface babies, which are very pretty in my opinion. so if you want whitefaces you'd be best with a whiteface hen. all other pairings would likely result in grey babies, but if the male has hidden splits, you may be surprised.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

Tez54 said:


> I would have them in different cages for about a week, but near enough other so they can see each other and see how they respond, as for the nest box, most definitely a wood one as they chew and will easily get out of the carton. make sure the female is over 1 year old and apart from the barring on the tail feathers they will also have spots under their wings, and the females are not as vocal as the males, maybe you should get a book on Cockatiels or look them up on the internet you can get lots of advise from there.


im saying 30 days because of health reasons... quarantine
and you wont find better information out there on the internet... this forum covers it all, this will give you more accurate info. lots of websites are very faulty and you cant trust them. same goes with books. i have a few and i have to personally edit them because they got loads of false information.


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## Conurekidd (May 16, 2011)

Yea you most likely will get the one wf split pied. 
Rest result grey but males will carry the split.


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## Conurekidd (May 16, 2011)

DallyTsuka said:


> im saying 30 days because of health reasons... quarantine
> and you wont find better information out there on the internet... this forum covers it all, this will give you more accurate info. lots of websites are very faulty and you cant trust them. same goes with books. i have a few and i have to personally edit them because they got loads of false information.



New bird comes in I vet and quarantine for 2 weeks. 2 weeks because they pass there scan and honestly don't have to. But I do just to be safe. But Quarantine is essential and extreamlly important to ensure you babies health. 

And if not vet Iv been told that the 30 days is to soon and it's been upped to 40 to 60 days. Idk though. My father in law does this. Just recently started too.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

30 days is minimum, but if vetted and cleared i dont see a problem with how you do it.

because of some people's living space sometimes its not feasable to do a proper quarantine. technically almost no one can. proper full out quarantine requires whole different air and building lol not many can do this. and some people dont have the room or predicament to do a normal quarantine either. but its still reccomended. but in the end, its the persons own risk if they dont, so its still in the end all up to them.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

I think the best way for me is tomorrow I will go to bird's shop to get some pics then posting on this topic  so you can help me find out which one I can buy.

About the nest box,I will choose wooden,but which size is the best ( length : width : height )

Thanks


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

nest box, no smaller than 10 inches in any side but 12 inches or more is better

and we will be here to help you tomorrow with which one


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Here are some pix's (click for a larger view) to help see the difference between a male and female normal grey.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

> keep in mind, the way to tell if that grey tiel is a female is if its older than a year for sure... *grey tiels all look like females* when babies so look for a bird older than a year.


So does it mean all normal grey males do NOT have the yellow mask when babies?
I dont understand because when I bought my two tiels,they are not 1 year old but they have already had the yellow mask.


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## lperry82 (Aug 2, 2010)

No they wont have the yellow mask when they are babies, My beano (grey) on the pic on my signature is when i got him and he is going through his first moult now so he is about 6 - 8 months old. Lucky is my female grey


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*So does it mean all normal grey males will NOT have the yellow mask when babies?
I dont understand because when I bought my two tiels,they are not 1 year old but they have already had the yellow mask*.
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Males can *start* to molt in their adult colors from 6-9 months, and have the full yellow face by the time they are a year old.

Both sexes have the female coloration until the first molt starts. The young male will molt in solid flight feathers to replaced the dotted feathers. He will also molt in solid grey feathers on the lower body to replace the barred feathers. The yellow to the face will molt in gradually feather by feather over a few months until he gets the full yellow facial mask.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Many many thanks for both of your useful posts,I was learned too much from this topic.
I can distinguish the gender for normal grey tiels now ,and tmr I will try to get a grey female,but as Dally mentioned I will try to look for any whitefaced female first ^^!, will take some pics of another tiels's type like lutino,pearl... to get your confirmed :clap:
Thanks all,


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Hello all,

I just went to bird's shop and get some pics now,pls help me find out which one is female  ,at this time this shop doesn't have normal grey tiels, there're 2 lubinos and 2 pearl but these lubinos are albino I think bcoz they have red eyes,so here are 2 pearl tiels: (bird in second and third pic is one)









I have asked the shop keeper and he told me that females have lighter color of cheeks than males  ,is that true?

Btw,I just wondering about this: If a female have already paired,can I seperate she and pair with my grey tiel? Will they get mating? If that's OK,so when this happen ( I mean the common time when breeding season starts)

Thanks all,


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## xoxsarahxox (Dec 13, 2010)

Okay do you know how old these birds are? If over a year old( gone through their first molt) then they would be females since male pearls lose their pearls when they molt. 

Normal grey females have lighter cheeks than males but this is not the case with other mutations. My lutino Aero, I was told by the petshop was a male because of the bright cheek patches but she has in fact turned out to be a female, so with mutations other than normal gray its hard to tell by cheek patches. Keeping in mind the age of the bird is a key factor as all young birds look female. And if a bird is a whiteface where females will retain their all grey face and males will molt in a bright white face. 

Im not an expert in the breeding department as I havent bred mine but hopefully someone else can help you there. Hope I helped

Oh I forgot something did the lutinos whom you call albino have all white faces or did they have orange cheek patches and a yellow crest? Lutinos have red eyes as you can tell from my siggy( Aero is a lutino) an albino or whiteface lutino(which is the correct mutation name) will be all white.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Thank you sarah,
And as Dally mentioned,I understood about the age of the bird is a key factor, but I'm not sure the petshop know about it exactly or not ,he told me they're around 1 year old.If it's a only sign to find out where the female,I'm still not sure to buy coz I have 2 males now,if one more... omg T_T




> Oh I forgot something did the lutinos whom you call albino have all white faces or did they have orange cheek patches and a yellow crest? Lutinos have red eyes as you can tell from my siggy( Aero is a lutino) an albino or whiteface lutino(which is the correct mutation name) will be all white.


they have orange cheek patches and a yellow crest,all look like a normal Lutino except their eyes,they have red eyes like your Aero. I dont know exactly if I misunderstand about albino,but I was told that an albino tiel have red eyes,that was caused by 2 tiels in same parents get mating( same blood ),is that true?


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## xoxsarahxox (Dec 13, 2010)

Hmm most birds begin their molt at about 6-9 months so if their around a year old then there is a high possibility that their females but Id wait for others to lend their input also.

And no Aero is not an abino she is a lutino. Lutinos have the orange cheek patches and yellowing face and crest, lutinos have red eyes and so do albinos because albinos are actually whiteface lutinos. Albinos( whiteface lutino is the mutation) are all white head to tail. Here is a link to a picture of an albino.
And since they are not "true" albinos( they are a combo of whiteface and lutino) I dont think they have a shorter lifespan.

http://www.tieltreasures.com/Mutation/white face lutino 054-1.JPG


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

the bird looks female in the photos.

but she does look a bit off and from questional place.... i would search elsewhere... she looks like she may be unhealthy. a bit poofed up...


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

> And no Aero is not an abino she is a lutino. Lutinos have the orange cheek patches and yellowing face and crest, lutinos have red eyes and so do albinos because albinos are actually whiteface lutinos. Albinos( whiteface lutino is the mutation) are all white head to tail. Here is a link to a picture of an albino.
> And since they are not "true" albinos( they are a combo of whiteface and lutino) I dont think they have a shorter lifespan.


Yea I'm sorry about this,maybe the reason your Aero has red eye is she's a baby of 2 tiels that have same blood(sibling relations) ^^



> the bird looks female in the photos.


Do you mean both of them or which one? coz there're 2 pearl tiels 

And also pls help me about this:


> Btw,I just wondering about this: If a female have already paired,can I seperate she and pair with my grey tiel? Will they get mating? If that's OK,so when this happen ( I mean the common time when breeding season starts)


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## geenz (Apr 4, 2011)

tommy1412 said:


> Yea I'm sorry about this,maybe the reason your Aero has red eye is she's a baby of 2 tiels that have same blood(sibling relations) ^^




What? Lutino's get red eyes simply because that's what nature gave them. I'm pretty sure breeding siblings together has nothing to do with Aero's red eyes


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## xoxsarahxox (Dec 13, 2010)

Yea I just googled it now and I didnt find an overly good answer other than it has to do with the lack of dark pigment lutinos have.

Since both birds have the same amount of pearls and are around the same age I would say they both look female then.

p.s Post number 1000!!!!whoooot:rofl:


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Allright,I will back to petshop and buy a pearl tiel with lighter cheek patch now ^^

And still hope any1 can explain this problem:


> I just wondering about this: If a female have already paired,can I seperate her and pair with my grey tiel? Will they get mating? If that's OK,so when this happen ( I mean the common time when breeding season starts)


Thanks all,


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

Finally I bought this lutino instead of pearl b4,pls pls help me check its gender


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## xoxsarahxox (Dec 13, 2010)

Hmm can you see whether the bird has bars on his/her tail, on mine it is very noticable but on some the bars can be quite faint you
might need to shine a light on the tail. Also you could check the wing spot sexing thread in the genetics and mutation section, and sex your birds wing the same as a normal greys wing.( i'd give you the link but I'm on my phone)


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## lperry82 (Aug 2, 2010)

Here is the thread  http://www.talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=18307


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*Yea I'm sorry about this,maybe the reason your Aero has red eye is she's a baby of 2 tiels that have same blood(sibling relations) ^^*

The reason why the lutino eyes and skin are lighter is because: the Lutino mutation is devoid of melanin. This affects the eyes, which will appear red from the blood vessels showing thru at the back of the eye. The beak and feet will be lighter due to the melanin being suppressed. 

Melanin is the dark pigment that makes up the color of the normal greys. If is suppressed with cinnamons and shows up as a brownish color. With pearls the melanin is partially suppressed on each patterned feather on the back of the bird. As a male molts out it's pearl the melanin is no longer suppressed.


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## Conurekidd (May 16, 2011)

Also whitefaces lutino is not a acual mutation. But a cross. 
They would be albino but the birds are not white. Rather blue. Same with whitefaces. It's just our eyes cant pick up this image there for we see white. The melanin is removed thus lutino. And so is the other suffusions Removed thus thus whiteface resulting in a cross mutation. Usally your male has to split lutino you don't get it from crossing a white face with lutino But rather crossing a male split wf and ino pairing with a wf hen. Preferably pied. . Its my favorite mutation lol


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

About repairing your hen...is she bonded to the male she's with now? If you repaired her, you'd have to let her bond to the new male before setting them up for breeding. Otherwise you would have a bondage pair and they'd most likely either not be good parents together (even if she's raised a clutch before) or kill the babies. So you have to let them have some time together.


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## tommy1412 (May 20, 2011)

> About repairing your hen...is she bonded to the male she's with now? If you repaired her, you'd have to let her bond to the new male before setting them up for breeding. Otherwise you would have a bondage pair and they'd most likely either not be good parents together (even if she's raised a clutch before) or kill the babies. So you have to let them have some time together.


Well,in fact I'm still not sure she's a female or not , but I have seen few signs that she's bonding with my grey male now.And seems my grey tiel like her,too,he singing,performing a few moves around the lutino female ( I guess that he's trying to get some points with her  ),this never happened b4 while I misunderstand that I had a pair until yesterday T_T
I'm not sure it's a sign of bond or just 2 males perform with each other but no problem at all,just for fun if that lutino is one male more ^^ and I will try to get new female later,otherwise I will try to breed them coz I love cockatiels especially their babies so much.
Finally,want to say thanks to everyone that helped me to solve out my problems.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

youre welcome  good luck, we will help you out with anything you ever need


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