# May be on to Something



## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

So I've been watching my pairs and keeping notes and I think I may be figuring out what's going on. Like to like creates a lot of issues in the nest and I think my flock is the perfect example. The two pairs I have set up right now are not like to like and the babies are thriving.

SO...I'm going to try something. Fuzzy (my normal pearl male) and Hershey (my WF lutino hen) have always had a thing for each other, what I would call an affair if you would. It's going to break my heart to see Bubbles lonely because she only has eyes for Fuzzy but I think this may be the answer to my issue. If it works and they have healthy babies, then I'm going to have to find Snowball a new, non-cinnamon/WF mate. I really didn't intend for them to pick each other, they just kinda did it for me. So we'll see how it goes.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

You might get bald spots from that pair, but we'll see!


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

He's also split to pied (she may be as well, I can't tell with her lol) and his baby now (well Spike's not really a baby anymore lol) has a SUPER crest, I mean the thing is HUGE. And Fuzzy has a super crest as well. Besides the fact that Hershey has very minimal thinning on the back of her head (there are feathers there, its just very light.) So it will be interesting to see how they feather out.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Maybe not so bad then..I'll be looking forward to baby pics!


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

I'll have to post the ones I have now...updated ones of the older three and some of the three new ones. Jeep's babies are HUGE compared to the other babies (Screech is on the small side too so thinking there was like to like going on there as well) so that's really what got me thinking on this.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

From personal experience I know you will definitely see a difference.

Back when I first started breeding Whiteface were small birds and not that common and the prices were outrageous. When they were imported into the country, the breeders that could afford them paired visuals together to increase the numbers of the mutation. 

A breeder named Dale Thompson advised many of these breeders to please pair with a normal (orange cheek mutation) for splits to later pair back with visuals. Once this was done, breeders realized that out-crossing to normals help to improved the mutation, especially on serviceability in the nest. 

In the early 1990's Whiteface had the reputation of being hard to breed because it was hard to have a baby in the nest to survive. Once breeders strated to outcross and pair with a split loses were less, BUT, many made the mistake of taking the visual from the split to visual pairing to pair with a visual in the next generation, thinking that since this visual was from a split their problems in the nest were over. Not so... Back then in order to improve the Whiteface mutation it was advisable to start with a visual and pair with a normal for splits. Then pair this bird with another split to WF. Then the next generation pair the split to a visual.

*For example to the above.*
First generation: Visual Whiteface with a Normal
Second generation: Split to Whiteface, paired with a split to Whiteface
Third Generation: Split to Whiteface to a visual Whiteface
Fourth Generation: Split to Whiteface to a visual Whiteface.

By now the strength/immunity, vigor and size have increased.

By the 5th generation a breeder might consider a visual to visual pairing. There should be no problems in the nest, and the babies should weigh as much as the parents up to 10 grams more by weaning.

Sixth generation: Pair this visual with a split.

The above is what I did with most of the cockatiels I worked with, regardless of the color mutation.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

> The above is what I did with most of the cockatiels I worked with, regardless of the color mutation.


I think this is what I'm gonna have to do. Too many deaths to be normal and when a necropsy comes up normal that means the husbandry needs to be questioned. I would love to keep a normal boy from Fuzzy (and with this pairing of him and Hershey I would definitely get one) just because he has the most awesome disposition ever.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Roxy....What I can do is loan you the 6 normals I have here for breeding for splits. I still haven't set anyone up, and they are all around 2-3 years old. There are 4 females and 2 males. 

I've been meaning to get out the blacklight to try and see if split to WF also shows up that way too. A couple of them may be split to WF and/or WF pied.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

> Roxy....What I can do is loan you the 6 normals I have here for breeding for splits. I still haven't set anyone up, and they are all around 2-3 years old. There are 4 females and 2 males.


O no that's OK, I think my hubby would freak out if he came home and I had more birds lol. Fuzzy and Hershey are actually bonded (is it possible for a hen to be bonded to two males? She follows both, preens both, sits with both?) so I wouldn't have to worry about that part. It will be interesting to see what happens.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*(is it possible for a hen to be bonded to two males?*
------------------------------------- 
Lol...Yes it is. I remember Cup Cup (short for Butter Cup) was in love with both the Bug, (short for June Bug) and Pork Chop (kids named him because he was a big baby) and would only go to nest if she had both males. But, the reason for this is because they all weaned out together, and she bonded with the Bug while weaning, and the Bug looked up to Pork Chop like a big brother and followed him everywhere. So wherever Pork Chop went, the other two had to go, and June Bug would share Cup Cup to him. Ah...what a birdie Soap Opera....As the Feather Turns


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## delawaregirl (Dec 2, 2011)

Roxy--Are these (like to like pairing) that you bred prior to your move?


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Yes...but there were three parents the first time feeding babies so I think that had something to do with the survival of the babies. (But this only applies to Snowball and Hershey the other pairs didn't start breeding until we got here.)


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