# Fatty Liver



## Ebolaoutkast (Nov 8, 2010)

So, this is about my aunt's bird. She's been up and down with some kind of liver condition for years, as well as problems with her nostrils that often get blocked and need to be cleaned by a vet. So now again, the bird is having health problems and I think it is severe this time, because the bird doesn't seem well. The vet doesn't know what is causing her enlarged liver, and she says the only way to know for sure is an expensive and dangerous biopsy. Since it is risky, they opted to give the bird like 5 different drugs instead hoping one will be effective. I don't know the names of the drugs, but I know one is the popular milk thistle. My aunt takes her to the vet about once a week, spending a ton of money.
In my opinion, I think this is the wrong approach. All those toxins combined with the stress on the bird I think are doing more harm than good, but the bird's liver problem is so severe the bird is straining to use the bathroom (so my aunt says) and has somewhat labored breathing. The bird is on Harrison's pellet food. Even though this is so often recommended, I would like to know why. The first ingredient is corn, than barely, than soybeans (which have been shown to contain isoflavins). Do cockatiels eat this much grain naturally? And it's all the bird gets (highly recommended by a reputable vet). 

If she was my bird, I would create a slurry of dandelion (healthy vegetable that stimulates bile production), rosehips (vitamin C), craneberries, raspberries, alfalfa powder, oregano, maybe some pumpkin to help with fiber, ect. I think these food items help support the immune system among other benefits. Also does anyone recommend 'aloe detox'? I would also want to combine a healthy vegetable detox with this method. 
2 Other things I want to address, the bird is in a pretty dimly lite apartment. I think it would be also hugely beneficial for the bird to receive full spectrum lighting, and also heat, which also supports the immune system. I would guess her apartment is about 70 degrees average, and I know she likes it on the cooler side. My experience is with reptiles, what do you think?


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

Cockatiels are granivores, so yes, they do eat quite a lot of grain/seeds in the wild. There's some info on this at http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=16205 But seeds alone aren't adequate and pellets provide many of the nutrients that are missing from a dry-seed diet. It's important for the bird to eat vegetables too, and sprouted grains/seeds provide better nutrition than dry ones. There's info on sprouting for birds at http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=9019

The treatment for fatty liver is dietary - there doesn't seem to be any other way to deal with it. Milk thistle is considered to be an herbal treatment not a drug - in the US at least anyone can walk into a health food store and buy it, there's no need for prescriptions or anything like that. 

Here are some links on treatment:
http://www.exoticpetvet.net/dvms/fattyliver.html This is a veterinary site which recommends milk thistle, dandelion, and aloe among other things.
http://www.avianweb.com/liverdisease.html
http://www.birdsnways.com/wisdom/ww61eiii.htm

Full spectrum lighting is a bit controversial, with some people swearing by it and others saying it's useless. It's worth trying, although it would be even better if the bird could get outside for some natural sunshine for a few minutes each day. If you go for the FS lighting, do NOT use bulbs made for reptiles because the UVB is much too strong for birds and can burn their eyes. Lighting made for birds or humans is much safer. 

Patrick Thrush is the leading authority on birds and lighting. His website is at http://users.mis.net/~pthrush/lighting/index2.html and the most important articles are at http://users.mis.net/~pthrush/lighting/hotspots.html and http://users.mis.net/~pthrush/lighting/spectrum.html It is his opinion that full spectrum lighting is not needed if the bird is getting adequate D3 from dietary sources, and Harrisons pellets do provide D3.


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## Ebolaoutkast (Nov 8, 2010)

> seeds alone aren't adequate and pellets provide many of the nutrients that are missing from a dry-seed diet. It's important for the bird to eat vegetables too, and sprouted grains/seeds provide better nutrition than dry ones.


I've always been confused as to why seed diets are terrible for them but that's the majority of what they eat in the wild. Where do they obtain the missing nutrition in the wild? 


> The treatment for fatty liver is dietary - there doesn't seem to be any other way to deal with it.


That's what I would think but I don't think her vet ever mentioned a change of diet from only harrisons and is prescribing several harsh medicines, I wish I remembered their names. I think the dandelion and aloe will do a lot.



> Full spectrum lighting is a bit controversial, with some people swearing by it and others saying it's useless.


Useless? Even people benefit significantly from this type of exposure, mood-wise, and that lowers stress. I feel that's even more important than vitamin D synthesis at this point. But instinct tells me, if a diurnal animal is exposed to sun often in the wild, the body would probably 'prefer' that as a source of vitamin D, as vitamins from various sources are rarely 'equal'. I'll look through the links though. Thanks for your reply


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Below is some info I have saved on my computer from past postings...

I have found that diet is only part of the problem. Liver problems can be secondary from egg related peritonitis, excessive iron in the diet (cereals, rice), from genetics, lack of excersise. LOL...pelleted diets are not going to help if the problem is already there, and I am a very Jaded person when it comes to vets pushing pellets especially if they are also selling them. 

Under normal circumstances a bird mfg. and synthesizes vitamin C in the body. When it is sick the body’s ability to do this is hindered, thus supplementing is needed. This is *especially* so when you have suspected hepatic (liver) problems or damage. Vitamin C is a great supplement when sick and to aid the body when there are liver problems. A liver is regenerative, but it needs to be given the *tools* to help heal itself.

Some of the tools are: Vitamin C (while sick), lactulose, natural exposure to sunlight or full spectrum lighting close to the caging, and a changing of caging, such as a flight cage that encourages more movement and exercise, or some flight time daily. When there are liver problems the function of the liver is hindered. This also can effect vitamin A which is formed in the liver from beta‑carotene, thus supplementing of beta-carotene is needed. An increase of the water soluble nutrients to the body. Brewers Yeast is an excellent source for these.

Milk thistle can be given for liver problems. Dandelion can also be given to detoxify and act as a stimulant to the liver. 1 drop of each (in extract form) to each 1/2 ounce of lactulose (some info below) can be mixed up and the bird given a drop 2 times a day. These 2 herbal extracts can also be added to the drinking water at a ratio of 1 drop to 3 ounces of water, and changed 2 times a day.

I've found that everything has a *cause and effect* to other body functions in our feathered friends. To help them many times we have to get to the root of the problem. Such as *why* your bird does have liver problem. Also how does this effect the other organs, and go from there. Many times giving the body the needed supplements and nutritional support (tools) can do more healing than any medication.


*Lactulose (Cephulac)*​

Lactulose acts as an osmosis retardant to the absorption of potential toxins from the GI tract. Used as a treatment with liver disease to decrease the load of metabolites that must be processed through the liver. What this does is reduce toxic potential of the blood ammonia due to liver dysfunction. 

It also acts as an appetite stimulant. 

It acidifies the intestinal contents.

It is also be effective in establishing a gastrointestinal environment that favors the growth of intestinal flora. This eliminates the need for lactobacillus supplementing. Lactulose can be used daily for weeks. *If diarrhea is noted reduce the dosage.*


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

> I've always been confused as to why seed diets are terrible for them but that's the majority of what they eat in the wild. Where do they obtain the missing nutrition in the wild?


The wild seed diet is very different from the captive one. In the wild they get seeds in all stages of development including the unripe/green stage, while in captivity they only get dry, mature seed. The wild-diet study established that the "milky" stage of unripe seed was the cockatiels' favorite. I give my birds home-grown sprouts and unripe grass seed (when available) in an effort to bring their diet a little closer to nature.

In the wild they have the ability to seek out whatever supplements they need, like getting minerals from grit (which many people won't let their pet birds have). I've heard that wild cockatiels chew the stems of grasses and other plants to extract the juices, and feeding veggies in captivity helps supply this part of the diet.



> Useless? Even people benefit significantly from this type of exposure, mood-wise, and that lowers stress


My avian vet is one of the people who thinks full spectrum lights are useless lol. I have one anyway but I take my birds outside for some real sunshine when the weather allows. I'd love to have an outdoor aviary so they could spend more time outside but there are too many predators around. When I take them outside (in a cage) I have to stay with them and do guard duty.


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## Ebolaoutkast (Nov 8, 2010)

Thanks for the replies! I think that the birds should have access to fresh 'real' foods.


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## barb2birds (Mar 23, 2010)

Hi I just wanted to say that I have a bright light for my depression when there is lack of light during fall, winter times for me. And I shine it on my 2 cockatiels cages. They love it! I think light in the home makes a big difference if you cannot get outside, plus a good bird supplement with all of the necessary vitamins and minerals birds need. I give my birds Sunscriptions supplements. My cockatiel Baby didn't like the taste of the other supplement I had and switched back to the Sunscription he had when he was younger. He is 13 now. I am also going to get some milk thistle and dandelion because I have suspected a slight liver problem. He was on an all seed diet for 7 years and that was not good for him. The vet never suggested a liver problem. I have changed the diet to 3 kinds of pellets because they will not eat just one kind. They love the mixture. I have another cockatiel Beenie who is going to be 7 on December 4th.

Thanks for all of your info friends


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