# What is endotril?



## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

I've finally gotten a vet appoint for Chewy and Bliss, and turns out they both have giardia! 

Vet thinks it's from the tap water they drink because of the water we have here, and have given them both enrotril by mouth, twice a day.


Does anyone know more about this medication? Google doesn't tell me much 


Oh, and Chewy turns out to be a girl , just a very bold and outgoing girl 

Having googled a bit I'm now confused. Enrotril seems to be more for respitory issues than giardia.. Has anyone used it before?


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

In the US it is pretty common through infected drinking water when people give their birds tap water from hoses I've heard. Scary about the tap water, I would ask your vet a safe way to sterilize it to kill the giardia in the future or buy him safe water from the store to drink.

Enrotril is "Baytril" or "Enrofloxacin". http://www.melbournebirdvet.com/baytril-the-myths-and-reality.aspx

If it is the parasite that caused it and not a bacteria.. I'm not sure how effective it would be at killing parasites because Enrofloxacin has no effect on parasite treatment. Unless it is a bacteria problem, or he is getting something else to treat the parasites on top of that I don't think it'd help for the parasites it's not an antiprotozoal medication I don't think. It's more for bacteria and respiratory infections. I have heard of Giardia being treated with antibiotics before though, I just don't know if that is the most effective one since it's not really on the typical lists of what is used to treat giardia that I've seen. :S
http://www.beautyofbirds.com/giardia.html


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

Thanks Kiwi,

Got hold of vet clinic, they said enrotril is for bacteria found in her crop wash, not for giadia (Bliss also got flagyl for that) Chewy only got enrotril because they live together.


Now it's a lot more clear what i am doing. According to my birds enrotril tastes better than Flagyl


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

That's good that it's for bacteria! 

I would keep their cage super clean while treating them to prevent them from becoming reinfected by giardia.

Enrotril is super awful, I've tasted it before. Kiwi seemed to like it better with apple juice. I guess Flagyl must have also have a very strong taste to it! I hope they're being good taking their meds. And I hope they get better soon!


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

yeah I spent 3 hours cleaning their house after the vet visit
things got washed and bleached and washed again and then dried
Everything got wiped down

Chewy isn't too bad with the enrotril she gets on with it. 
Bliss on the other hand hates both of the meds; she refuses to swallow and one time flagyl was coming out of her nostrils. She also continues to spit, cough and weeze for a good 20mins everytime afterwards.. she sure knows how to make me feel guilty handling her this way


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## TamaMoo (Jan 12, 2014)

Hope your little sweeties are all better soon.  

We've recently moved, and the tap water in this town seems to be better than the last one we were in. I still give Joey water from the Brita pitcher just to be on the safe side. I know that even the filtered water isn't guaranteed safe, but it makes me feel a little better.


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

Thanks TamaMoo

My vet recommends boiling water in a pan/pot and keep it on boil for 2 minutes to effectively kill giardia


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

It sounds like she chokes a bit on it. My 'tiel hates the taste so that's why I mixed it with a bit of apple juice to make the meds taste better. Some vets mix it with sugar or flavor it with strawberry in my area to make it easier to swallow. Maybe ask your vet if it is ok to mix it and get instructions on the amount of it to make it easier for her to take? I take a little apple juice for Kiwi and put some on a spoon and then mix up the apple juice and baytril with the syringe. The Enrotril is what is given to prevent pnemonia from aspiration so if some gets in her lungs from the choking, she's already on antibiotics. 

You might want to look at this link for supportive help after an aspiration just in case:
http://oi60.tinypic.com/2h67bmg.jpg
For preventatives I would at least have carbo vegetabilis on hand along with the dandelion root just in case to help get water out of the lungs and help her get air if she does aspirate too much. You can find that if you scroll all the way down to the bottom of this link below. 
http://www.justcockatiels.net/sour-and-slow-crop-remedies.html

I like using this grip with Kiwi. It's either that or toweling, she hates both! >.< You can see the grip in both pictures, one explains it better:
http://s525.photobucket.com/user/Mousebirds-and-more/media/Other birds/Hand-position-illus.jpg.html
http://oi60.tinypic.com/xb9uts.jpg


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

Thanks Kiwi, I might give the mixing a try .. also thanks for the grip diagrams they are very good!

I use the second version but with a towel. I might try using a syringe instead of the dropper supplied as well - the droppers have a wide tip which isn't ideal to shove down their tiny beaks


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

No problem! The pictures were made by the forums cockatiel breeder the marvelous srtiels! 

I believe for Kiwi the amount was around 1 ml max with the juice mixed in, her baytril was 0.1 ml. I would ask your vet what their amount would be so you can do the right dosage. 

Does your vet have any syringes? Sometimes they'll give you a bunch for free. I would test them out first though because a few of them can either stick or be loose. When I have some that stick I just move the syringe back and forth a few times to try and loosen it up because it is easy for medication to shoot into their mouths. The loose ones are a little better, you just have to be very careful still not to have it all go in at once. The ones I'm given are usually the cheap disposable ones so they're not made to last too long. There are always a few good ones in the batch that are great so that's why I love when they give you a big bag of them. Maybe ask for a couple of them just in case.


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

I had made up a one ml mixture of sugary herbal tea (didn't get juice in time), enrotril and flagyl and administered via a syringe.. Bliss didn't choke this time! Although I think half of it went on the towel at least the flagyl suspension went into her mouth and not her wind pipe.


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

I'm glad that she didn't choke this time! Hopefully she'll swallow more of the next batch next time. I think a sugary herbal tea would be fine to use, it is probably healthier than apple juice. You just want something to take away the bad taste of the medicine and make it easier to take.


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

I think it tasted good because I mixed up Chewy's enrotril with the same thing and she went back to lick the dish i prepared it in lol.


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

Aww that's good that Chewy liked it! She actually wants more of it, that must be one good herbal tea! :lol:

Maybe you can add a little oregano to their diets while they are on the meds. It can help kill giardia, it might help them get rid of it faster. 
http://forums.avianavenue.com/index.php?threads/oregano.40891/
http://www.beautyofbirds.com/giardia.html


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## Brandon2k14 (Nov 26, 2014)

Every animal ive owned I have never given them tap water its very bad even for us humans I filter my water and sometimes use bottled water either way I think tap water is just disgusting because its coming through pipes and there could be dirt inside the pipes lol anything could be in there.


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

The pipes in my house aren't too bad, but it's Minnesota water which is known to have a metallic taste to it. If you drink any water here that is from tap it will taste a little like a copper penny. ._.
Kiwi seems to like it for some reason, but I think it is more the falling water she's attracted to. I giver her bottled water to avoid the taste and because the water softener takes out a lot of the good stuff and replaces it with other stuff. Also because of fluoride. There are also doctors raising concern about fluoride being in our water here and negative health effects that may be caused by it. I don't think Ireland has any fluoride in the water if I remember right. It's mostly cause I drink bottled water and so I give Kiwi it. Of course she's addicted to tap for some reason so she'll get a little bit once in a while. xD
But there are some particles or heavy metals in older pipes, I'm mostly worried about fluoride here though since the pipes aren't that old. o,o


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

For anyone that is interested my vet bill for these two rascals was ~$500AUD including gram stain, blood test, crop wash,worming and the 2 meds :eek


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## Kiwi (May 12, 2013)

The things we do for our babies. I wish the bills weren't so high! >.<

Hopefully they feel much better after they are done with their meds. I bet they'll give you lots of snuggles once they're all better. :3


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## phronima (Jan 12, 2015)

Chewy is her same old happy self.. Bliss is definitely better, she's chirping a lot more, flying more and I event caught her rubbing her vent on top of the cage lol


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