# Sloppy Feeders...



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Below is a very long posting...I thought might be helpful, since I am dealing with this with a baby now (pix 1)​
Sloppy Feeders​Below is photo’s showing a few things to watch for when you have chicks in the nest. The majority of the time all goes well with the babies in the nest box. Even so, it is always good to do a daily check to make sure things are fine with the babies. Many parents are excellent feeders. Every once in awhile there will be a parent (many times a first timer) that is sloppy in regurgitating food while feeding the babies.

1...the first 2 pix’s shows babies with food of the face, beak, and impacted in the mouth. When the mouth/throat is impacted this will block the food from entering in the crop. If not corrected the baby gets weak and can die within 24-30 hours. The other problem is that this accumulation of food is a breeding group for bacteria and yeast.

2... The 3rd. Pix shows some things I have used to aid in cleaning the mouth. ***There are also notes on each illustration. In order to turn this around I will gently use the rounded end of a flat toothpick to remove any loose food. Do NOT try to dig or force the food from under the tongue. Many times this can result in bleeding. Once the excess is removed from the mouth, beak and/or head I will swab the inside of the mouth with a Q-tip dampened in vinegar 2-3 times a day. The vinegar helps to loosen any yeast that has started to bud and adhere to the skin, and by the 4-5 day it is easily swabbed away. If the crop is empty due to the blockage in the mouth I will also assist feed with a formula that has a ‘light sprinkle’ of garlic powder added. The benefits of garlic are: 
_Garlic: (Allium Sativum) Garlic contains Vitamins A, B, C, and E, selenium. These vitamins also act as a stimuli to the immune system. Garlic supports the natural intestinal flora which helps to inhibit yeast and bacterial growth. It is the sulphur constituents, such as allicin and ajoene, that contribute to garlic's antibiotic properties. When combined with conventional medications it supports their actions, yet protects the liver from harmful side effects. This is especially beneficial when treating for respiratory and digestive infections.

_3...The 4th pix shows what a healthy mouth should look like.

4...The 5th pix shows yeast built up under the tongue.

5...The last pix shows another thing to look for, that you do not want to see. When checking on the babies also look at the crop. When you have good feeders many times the crop can look almost as big as the body of the baby. It is the actual crop contents you want to look at. Again this illustration has some info. What you want to see is a normal crop as shown in the lower right corner. The contents are ususally visible thru the skin. They should look evenly mixed with no fluids floating to the top or obvious settling at the base of the drop. When the crop looks like the other examples in the pix this is a ‘red flag’ that something is wrong. To the inexperienced eye it appears that the parents overfed and was the cause of death. When the crop looks huge, with a bloated gassy look and separation of the crop contents what is going on is sour crop. This can be very life threatening and if not corrected the baby can die from aspiration in addition to a systemic (meaning throughout the body…AKA Septicema) How this happens is the crop contents turn sour/acidic. This acidic environment causes the muscles to become atonic (meaning they can are longer be elastic and contract)…thus the crop tissue becomes over-stretched. How the baby gets septicema is when the blood vessels/veins are distended/swollen they absorb the pathogens building up in the crop and are distributed thru the bloodstream to all the organs in the body. This would be a true emergency and once Septicema is apparent it is very difficult to save this type of condition. If expereinced the first step would be to totally empty and flush the crop. If the baby appears to be dehydrated many times this is due to an infection going on in the GI tract which will also cause regurgitation of the proventricular fluid which also adds to the excess fluid in the crop, and compounds dehydration. So a baby like this would also have to be re-hydrated. A vet would prescribe appropriate antibiotics and antifungals. To correct the over-stretched tissue a crop bra (illus 7) would have to be made. Average time to sucessfully reverse the damage is 2-3 weeks.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Last 2 pix...


----------



## Tony's Tiels (May 21, 2009)

Thank You for posting, as always great info.
I want to clarify if the vinagar q-tip (no excees dripping) 
is safe for the top of the mouth
& what about blocked nostrils from sloppy feeders ?


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Thanks... As to the Q-tip blot off most of the excess. As to the choana part in the roof of the mouth just swab gently on either side of the slit.

As to nostrils it depends on how far in the food or seed is in. If half exposed you can use the tip of a toothpick to pick it out. If into the nostril whereas the top is showing take a syringe with a large opening, place the tip against the hole and pull back on the plunger to try and suck it out. A rubber bulb/aspirator used for infants will also do.


----------



## Tony's Tiels (May 21, 2009)

perfect, Thank You 
Gotta go do this now.....


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Good luck  It is obsevations and interventions like this that in the end result make breeding rewarding.


----------



## Tony's Tiels (May 21, 2009)

The 3 older WF chicks were very enjoyable to work with today, as always, mom even fed them during our inspection & 'de-pinning' (grooming)
The 2 younger whiteface cinamin pearls, told me their names during their cleaning, I hate to name them so young, praying everything is okay with them.
Mom & dad were very upset about it, but this is the 3rd day in row, they need to learn this will be an everyday event.

Everyone looks healthy as far as I can tell.
Thank You for the excellent pics in your post


----------



## Tiana (Jun 13, 2009)

Hello, I was wondering, Tony's Tiel said that it is important to look in the nesting box every day to make sure that the babies are doing well. My question is if the parents are sitting on a younger tiel , would you advice to try to move the parents off the baby to get a look. Cause when I check on the babies [ not every day ] sometimes the parents hide them.


----------



## Tony's Tiels (May 21, 2009)

in reply to Tiana;
we have parents that want to hide their chicks, as most good bird parents do.
We wait until the parents are both out for their afternoon feeding of soft foods to inspect the chicks, this way we do not risk accidental injury to the fragile chicks, or eggs remaining to hatch.
In addition, we do offer the soft foods for parent birds fresh every 4-5 hours, 
the morning & sunset being most important, 
our flock knows the routine feeding times which makes nest box inspections very easy...well,, most of the time.
Hope this helps 
A Predictable Routine is the key to any succesfull relationship with any animal


----------



## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

The parents tend to sit pretty tight when the chicks are very young, but if you're alert it should be possible to find a moment every now and then when they're both out of the nest. When the chicks get a little bit older the parents start spending a lot of time out of the nest getting food, so it's easy to check then.


----------



## Tiana (Jun 13, 2009)

Thank you all for your really good advice. I was also wondering what is a good age to pull a baby/babies cockatiels to hand feed them ? I am not new to hand feeding but I am new to breeding cockatiels and feeding there babies. If any one has any advice for me I loved to hear it. I have been breeding Lovebirds, and hand feeding the babies. I have baby cockatiels in the nest box that look about 3 weeks old to me, [well the oldest one does any way] there are 4 healthy babies and I have a few others that are sitting on eggs. Would any one know where a good place to advertise the babies I want to sell. Thanks again.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I make it a habit from the time the pair is setup to have them get used to me looking in the box, and also reaching into the box. This way when the babies have hatched I can reach in and gently move the parent aside with the back side of my hand to see the babies (or eggs)


----------



## Tiana (Jun 13, 2009)

Thank you . I have to admit I just picked up the cockatiels this weekend . I don't know much about them, I do know that the parents and babies are afraid when I try to look in on them. I figured being I just got them I'd try to let them adjust first to there new surroundings, then I could start to look in on them every day. Can I ask if this is ok to do ? If they are out of the nesting box and I go to walk into the room everyone goes right back into the nesting box, I guess it's cause they are unformulated with me. I want to Thank everyone for all your help and great advice . Thank you all !


----------



## allen (Aug 25, 2007)

i want to thank you for this posting alot of us can learn from this and what to look for


----------



## Lovin_the_tiels (Jun 10, 2009)

SRTIELS..Awesome post!!Most Impressive!!I have never had any of the forementioned problems,,but there is always a first time,,I got very lucky with my first time parents,they used to be tame,but when they were placed together for breeding,they did not want to be touched,they had mind set for breeding not loving from the ''head momma''LOL,,my new babies are now almost 4weeks(first born)we call them our ''box dragons'',because when we open the box they sit and sway and ''hiss''feed me,feed me,,we wait for the parents to come out for their feeding,and we change out box,and handle each one,,its such a joy to watch them grow!!Once again,,AWESOME POST,SRTIELS!!


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Hi...and Thanks you 

Ah...yes...those little ones try to look and act so fearsome in the nest. 

You'll have to post a pix of your Dragon Family.


----------

