# i'm new here... sick tiel question...



## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

first off... i joined this group earlier in the week trying to get info about a sick cockatiel. i wasn't approved to post until it was too late. my tiel passed away yesterday. it all started last saturday, she flew to me, and shook her head - stuff flew out of her mouth. i did some research and found that she must have vomited instead of regurgitated. Since it didnt start with head bobbing. After the first incident of vomiting, she almost sounded wheezy for a minute, making squeaky-type sounds. plus a bit of head bobbing at that point. it seemed to clear up, thought something just must not have agreed with her. well, about 5 hrs later, it happened again. plus her stools started changing. she has always had solid stool, non sticky and light colored. at this point it was getting dark and runny. the white was still white, but the fecal portion was too dark. i took her to emergency.. but unfortunately there are no real bird vets there. i waited an hr + to hear, she didnt know what's wrong. so being it was a sat, i had to wait til Monday. I took her in, they said bacterial infection.. gave her an antibiotic injection and orbax to take home and give her twice daily. well... she continued to vomit, wasnt improving.. so she had to go back Tues for xrays and bloodwork. they determined it to be liver infection. so they gave her more antibiotic and fluids and force-feedings. kept her overnite.. not improvement, so they kept her another nite. i talked to the doc thurs and he wasn't happy with her progress (AKA none of it). i went in to visit, he wanted to keep her another nite. she was in horrible condition. i was not happy. i dont feel she got the right care. well i got ahold of a vet out of town, avian certified (wish i did this monday!!).. and set up a friday appt. i tried to keep her fed and hydrated Thurs nite with handfeeding once her crop would empty.. but i noticed it was taking a long time to empty. she was still vomiting. not all of the food, but enough to make me worry. well, when i woke up friday she looked half dead. but i decided to bring her anyway. if anything, i could refuse treatment or put her out of her misery. well, the vet said she still had some hope for her recovery. so we treated her again. this is what frustrates me... the tests sent over from the other vet, were incomplete. the xrays were ok. but she just didnt have enough info to make a sure disgnosis. and my bird was just too weak to draw any blood on at that point. plus the first place really butchered her trying to get blood, and giving her fluids. she was such a mess. i was in tears the minute i saw her when i picked her up from there! ugh, i hate to think of her that way. anyway, due to suspect of high white blood cell counts and elevated liver enzymes, the vet decided to try and treat for pssitacosis. which i found hard to believe she had. she was 6 years old, never went anywhere outside of my apartment. the rest of my birds are all from the same place, healthy, and also never go anywhere. no new additions. nothing pointed to that in my mind.. but i went with her because shes seen cases similar. and she knows birds.. i had no other choice at this point. i was holding onto any bit of hope, but also deep down was pretty sure she was too far gone.. well, she treated her, and nothing changed. she slept all day, and didnt perk up. was dehydrated and anemic. fluids didnt appear to help at this point. she vomited once during the day. the poor thing was just too weak and her body was shutting down. she passed away last night. sometime between 6 and 9. she went to feed her, and she was gone.  such a horrible week/experience. its so hard, she was the best bird. and i feel like the mistake of bringing her to that other vet monday and tues, killed her. since i have other birds, and she mentioned an infectious disease, i had her do an autopsy. but have not heard from her since she did it. i assume she may be waiting on some tests.. my poor girl was along when she died. i knew she was on the brink. but i wanted to save her. i just wish her last day of life didnt involved being poked so much. which me there with her. its so sad to think about. i feel like i caused this... 

my reason for posting after she has already passed, was to see if anyone else had an experience like this. with a vomiting cockatiel?? so sudden and out of nowhere!! she was fine the same day, in the morning! it hit from absolutely nowhere! was so scary! and i hope to never experience it again. she was the best bird i had, so attached to me. i feel lost without her here  i never thought it would be this hard, its the first bird ive lost. i dont know what to do with myself.. anyway, please share any similar stories. i want to know what happened. and i know i wont KNOW until the vet calls. but it still helps to hear other stories. Thanks for listening, sorry its so long


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## Shayla Fortune (Nov 29, 2012)

Awww I'm sorry to hear about your baby  I'm getting my first 'tiel in mid January and can't wait. I hope what ever your baby had wasn't infectious and the other's are ok. Good luck!


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

*Thank you..*

I call her my baby, cuz to me she was. But technically she was six. Still so young, she should have had so much more life to live. It's so sad!


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## AMSD (Nov 2, 2010)

I'm so sorry for your loss


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## birdsoo (Jul 4, 2012)

I am so sorry for your loss. I understand what you are going through, especially with her being alone there. I have had the same with my budgie..

It hurts so much to think that. Please do not beat yourself up. She knew how much you love her and she will be waiting for you at the rainbow bridge, with all our other feathered friends.


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## Hels (Oct 31, 2012)

I wish I could alleviate your need to know but all I can do is offer sympathy at your loss. Take care xx


Hels

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Annie (Nov 20, 2009)

I am very very sorry for your loss.  A few points I'd like to make after reading your post:

1) I'm not sure what could have made your bird sick but could she have been poisoned by something? Did she eat anything that could have killed her? Are you living in an old house where the window curtain rods are still made the "old" way with poisonous metals? That's how a friend of mine lost her budgie.

2) Try to seek out a better avian vet in the meantime so that in the future, should you get another bird, you'll have a good, reliable vet to go to. Vets are like any doctors or therapists. You need to seek out a few and find one you're comfortable with and not just walk into any place that calls themselves vets. A lot of them are just out to make money. I just went through that experience with Sunny this summer. Dropped $1,000 over one week-end because the vets there egged me on to do all kinds of tests when there was nothing really wrong. I have already sought out another clinic and am NEVER taking Sunny back there again.  So look up some vets online to see what other people are saying about them, try to get advice from their customers, do your research. When your precious babies are at stake, you can't afford not to. 

3) As others already mentioned, please don't blame yourself and your bird died alone. You did what any responsible owner would do in that situation. You brought her to the vet and did the best you could. If you hadn't and she died, you still would have blamed yourself for not having taken her to the vet. So don't fall into that vicious trap of either blaming yourself for taking or not taking her to the vet. You did your very best. You know you did and we can all see that. Your bird knew that to. Trust me, she did.  So please be at peace with this. 

Here's a favourite poem of mine that I'm always posting for people who lost tiels. May it comfort and heal you. :flowers:

*Lend Me A Bird*

"I will lend to you for a while, a bird", God said. 
For you to love her while she lives and to mourn for her when she is dead. 

Maybe for twelve or fourteen years, or maybe for two or three. 
But will you, till I call her back, take care of her for me? 

She'll bring her charms to gladden you and should her stay be brief, 
You'll always have her memories as solace for your grief. 

I cannot promise that she will stay, since all from earth return, 
But there are lessons taught below I want this bird to learn. 

I've looked the whole world over, in search of teachers true. 
And from the folks that crowd life's land, I have chosen you. 

Now will you give her all your love; nor think the labor vain; 
Nor hate me when I come to take my lovely bird again? 

I fancied that I heard them say, "Dear Lord, thy will be done, 
for all the joys this bird will bring, the risk of grief we'll run." 

Will you shelter her with tenderness? 
Will you love her while you may? 
And for the happiness you'll know forever grateful stay? 

But should I call her back much sooner than you've planned; 
Please brave the bitter grief that comes and try to understand. 

If, by your love, you've managed, my wishes to achieve, 
In memory of her you've loved; be thankful; do not grieve. 

Cherish every moment of your feathered charge. 
She filled your home with songs of joy the time she was alive. 
Let not her passing take from you those memories to enjoy. 

"I will lend to you, a bird", God said, and teach you all you have to do. 
And when I call her back to heaven, you will know she loved you too. 

(Author Unknown)


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Thanks everyone. I may feel better once the vet tells me what she found. I would be surprised if it was pssitacosis. But another option was polyoma. She had the symptoms of that. It would do pain her death, and it not being anyone's fault. But at the same time I do hope it's not that since I have five other birds. I think she must have sent out samples of tissues. She knows I need to know. Actually as far as finding a good vet, I did. The second one. But I just got to her too late  I wish their were more resources to know good vets from bad, but I did look as best I could for my area and didn't find anything. I am glad I got her out of that first hospital, but wish I did it sooner. Their idea of treating a sick bird was give her fluids/feed her and stick her in a barred cage. Any bird vet should know she needed an incubator in her state. Ugh. Plus they really struggled getting blood. She had a huge bruise on her neck. The second vet said that had to be extremely stressful for her. There are two preventable issues. Could have had a huge impact on her recovery while she was still stronger. When I called after her first night there they kept telling me no change but not worse. How could she not be worse if she wasn't eating on her own and she was losing weight. I guess this is what I blame myself for. Vet seemed to act like he knew wHat was happening. But clearly he did not. My poor girl suffered there in that cold hospital. She was not going to recover in those conditions. Ugh I know I have to stop thinking about it, but it's hard to do  My poor baby...


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## Annie (Nov 20, 2009)

Ha, that was exactly what the vet clinic I took Sunny to was like. Could you believe it, Sunny cycled through 5 vets  because whoever happened to be there that day was her vet . They didn't know what they were doing but they kept pretending they did and they think I didn't see through it in the end? I did and they knew it at the end that I saw through their act. After doing every test from A to Z which they suggested (and I said yes to EVERYTHING because I thought my poor baby's life was at stake ), I kept asking them "what's wrong with her? What's wrong with her?" They never once gave me a direct answer. Instead they would say everything else. One vet even brought out her fabulous book on avian medicine and gave me a mini lesson on avian meds 101 but not what I wanted to know. I feel so bad putting Sunny through all that at the vet just so they could make $1000 off me. They saw that I was willing to do anything from the very beginning so they went "perfect!!! She's one of those!"  Anyhow as I always say now, next year it will be a different vet who would get another $1000 off me. 

Off course it was extremely stressful on your poor baby to have to be manhandled and have blood taken from her.  Don't blame yourself anymore. You didn't know the first vet was bad, just like how I didn't know either that the stupid, :censor: clinic I took Sunny to was bad. Your baby is flying free now and no longer suffering. She must be looking down on you now and thanking you for all you did for her. Don't get obsessed with thinking about how much she suffered. Focus on the good times instead and all those times when you made her a happy birdie. That is what your bird would want.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Thanks, I am trying  I just miss her. She spent the most time out with me, and it gets lonely now. I am trying to do the same with the other two Tiels now. One likes my boyfriend much more. The other likes no one really. She's not that friendly. I could use suggestions as to good ways to socialize her. I guess I haven't worked with her enough since my other bird was always with me. 
Your bird actually looks like my baby. I will post a pic of her.


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

You said she was six years old, right? Polyoma generally only affects babies. 

I think either poisoning or a bacterial infection sounds more likely.

I'm very sorry for your loss.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

enigma731 said:


> You said she was six years old, right? Polyoma generally only affects babies.
> 
> I think either poisoning or a bacterial infection sounds more likely.
> 
> I'm very sorry for your loss.


Thank you. Hopefully both can be determined by an autopsy. 
What would cause such a serious bacterial infection that wouldn't react to injectable antibiotics? Poisoning is always a possibility, but what scares me is I have NO idea what she could have injested.  it's scary also bc I gotta make sure my other birds don't do the same. Whatever it is. The third option was blockage, she had an interest in fabric. Had to keep those fabric perches out of her cage. BUT she was passing some food. It was moving slow tho. So is a partial blockage possible? I have no idea. She just appeared to have all he symptoms of polyoma. Just no idea where she would have got it (she never goes anywhere) and none of my other birds are sick. So nothing completely fits. If it was something obvious I would assume the vet would have called yesterday right after the autopsy. So I assume she sent out organ tissue for testing. Which means it must be viral or bacterial or poisonous. Not an obvious blockage or growth. I just want/need to know. It's closure and it'll help me move on, and protect my other birds if necessary


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## Annie (Nov 20, 2009)

Stellar981 said:


> Thanks, I am trying  I just miss her. She spent the most time out with me, and it gets lonely now. I am trying to do the same with the other two Tiels now. One likes my boyfriend much more. The other likes no one really. She's not that friendly. I could use suggestions as to good ways to socialize her. I guess I haven't worked with her enough since my other bird was always with me.
> Your bird actually looks like my baby. I will post a pic of her.


Awww, she does look like my Sunny! 

Give your other "unfriendly" bird a chance. You may be surprised at how she can change once you give her a chance. :yes:


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Annie said:


> Awww, she does look like my Sunny!
> 
> Give your other "unfriendly" bird a chance. You may be surprised at how she can change once you give her a chance. :yes:


I've been trying. I have two other Tiels. But as long as my boyfriend is around, they do everything they can to get away from me. Itll never be the same with them, they just don't have her personality at all. I guess it's too soon. But it makes me sad when they want nothing to do with me.


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## sunnysmom (Sep 23, 2011)

I'm very sorry for your loss.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

So.. the vet called me back this morning. I guess nothing significant showed on the autopsy. No blockage or anything obvious. The liver was actually smaller than expected considering her blood test results. She is leaning towards something chronic. But can't give me a for sure answer. Doesn't really ease my mind much, because there is still the possibility of a toxin being the culprit. She said she took tissue samples, and I can have them tested if I choose to. It costs a bit however. She no longer suspects anything infectious, just looking at her organs. But I fear I may need the test for closure. The liver test alone is $160. Where the test of all organs is $300. What would everyone here do? Should this be enough to move on, or should I do the test(s)? I've already spent over $1000 for her care. I dont regret any of it. Just wish she could have made it through, and made all that torture worth it


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

Personally I would do the tests. But only you can make that decision, and I think there are compelling arguments for either side.


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## sunnysmom (Sep 23, 2011)

I probably would do the tests too. But it's completely understandable if you choose not to.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

I am leaning towards the tests.. just for closure and peace of mind. Plus I also have other birds. And who knows if I would want to bring in another bird in the future. If its infectious, I would hesitate to do so. So should I do just the liver, being the tests showed abnormal liver levels? Or should I just go for it all? Its a lot of money either way. But from what I've read elsewhere, maybe not even close to what other places charge!


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

it might be worth doing a test on all organs. because if its not the liver, it could be something else.

my lovebird munch came down suddenly ill last year. started not eating, lethargic, vomiting, dark tarry poop, some with blood after awhile.... she had avian gastric yeast infection. it went systematic and was attacking her kidneys.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Ohh.. What would cause that? And I am hoping she made it through this? 
Dont mind all the questions, but how did you find out it was that? Would this be a contagious infection? I appreciate everyone's input here! I wish I would have joined earlier, and kept up with reading and learning of others experiences. It could have saved her life. And yes, if I test all organs I am more bound to get an answer. I will know exactly what to look out for if it happens to another bird. 

This has been a very trying week. Definitely made me realize how much my bird(s) mean(t) to me. There are times when their chirping very loudly can get on my nerves, I'm sure everyone has their days. But losing her made me really realize what I had. A definitely reality check, and lesson learned in avian care - and the importance of doing your research before seeing a particular vet. Just because they say they can, doesn't mean they can!

Does anyone here think its a good idea to write a letter to the initial vet to express my feelings on her level of care while she was there? Im sure it will make no difference, but it may make me feel better and my voice will be heard. Or do I just let it go, and learn my lesson? What do you think?


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## eki (Sep 2, 2010)

My condolences. I've recently been through a string of vets before finding one that I like, and feel like she knows what she's doing with birds. I can't imagine having to puzzle that out with a bird that is fatally ill.

I don't know anything about what could've been, but I hope you get what you're looking for. If anything, I'd write tons of online reviews telling people to stay away, but if you think writing a letter to the vet's office itself would made you feel better, go for it!


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

she vomitted up yeast. yeast isnt generally infectious... but i think something else is going on here with your bird. i was simply sharing a similar experience, i know how scary it is when one minute theyre fine and next theyre so ill. birds hide illness so well that it can seem sudden. by the time they show signs, theyre often severely ill. it can be any disease. the necropsy likely would have shown a yeast infection by now as it's a fairly obvious illness.

what you do about the first vet is your decision. just remain polite no matter what you say 


i am sorry for your loss, but you are doing the right thing seeking answers to protect your other birds


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Well... i decided on the organ tests... so hopefully soon I will know for sure. Or have a real good idea. You are right, I dont think yeast would have killed her like this, and the vet would have likely seen that on the mouth swab she did on her. I find it interesting that when I brought my other bird in for regurgitating, she did a test on the crop contents. For this bird she only swabbed the mouth. I dont know if maybe the crop would have shown something else?

Who knows, its too late now. I guess I need to stop thinking about the what if's. I haven't written to the first vet yet. I was going to be polite. I just was really upset that she wasn't kept warm with how ill she was. And if they didnt have the means to keep her warm, they should have really recommended I bring her elsewhere. IMO. The vet just seemed kind of cold. Their site advertises they care for birds and exotics, I just feel they really didn't have the proper resources. I guess those are the two points I want to get across. As angry as I was, I know being mean doesn't get the point across. But I also feel there was a small possibility that my bird would have had a better chance at survival elsewhere. It saddens me


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## Frizzle (Nov 12, 2012)

Sorry to hear about your bird. : (

If I were you, I would make a google account, and write a "review" of the bad vets, with a link to the one you'd recommend. That way if other people are contemplating taking their birds there, they can see why not to. If you do, keep the points simple and write well so others will take your words seriously.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

I'm so sorry for your loss. 

The same thing happened to my Krissi with the vets. She was malnourished and thin..the doctor convinced me to do all sorts of tests on her, decided she was healthy other than liver problems. We did xrays, blood tests, disease testing, chem panels...everything. The doctor talked to me like I was stupid for taking in a 13 year old sick bird and like I had no idea what was going on or how to properly care for my birds. She started gaining weight and seemed healthy for about a month (though she was still thin) and then we found her dead in her cage one morning. We did get a necropsy done, but I requested it be a different vet than the one who cared for her and that was the last penny that clinic got from me. And they still send wellness reminders for the other 2 birds that went there. 

I would write to the vet. As for my second and current vet (the guy is amazing, but his staff is too incompetent to communicate and know the doctor needs to be present for extracting blood from a small bird's neck)..I drove 45 minutes to my vet and then waited for 30 minutes past my appointment time..then a nurse came out and told me that the doctor wasn't scheduled to work that day and they weren't permitted to draw blood from my bird. I didn't say a word. I was livid. I took Allie's cage and drove home. Then I wrote an email to the doctor explaining what happened and told him how far I drove there, how long I waited, how much the toll roads cost me to get there...I told him all the reasons I was upset. He wrote me back, apologized, and waived the exam fee on my visit. 

So I think you should write the first vet and express your concern for the care that your bird didn't receive properly. I was very nice and professional in my email to the doctor, but I got my point across.

I hope that the tests come back without anything contagious..the reason I got that necropsy on Krissi was to protect my other birds, so I hope you get some decent results.


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## cknauf (Aug 27, 2012)

I'm so sorry for the loss of your bird 

Another reason to contact the vet would be if you found out the cause of death. Several years back we lost a wonderful 3-year-old dog after a severe, sudden-onset fungal infection (I believe it was Cryptococcosis) in her heart was misdiagnosed as a genetic deformity (the infection was causing the valves in her heart to pump abnormally). She was too weak to recover by the time we got a second opinion and the infection was correctly diagnosed. We contacted the first vet after she passed, and I can only hope maybe the vet learned from the experience and the next dog will get a better diagnosis. Vets don't know everything, and abnormal cases can't always be taught through a book. Maybe your tragedy can prevent one down the road.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

bjknight93 said:


> I'm so sorry for your loss.
> 
> The same thing happened to my Krissi with the vets. She was malnourished and thin..the doctor convinced me to do all sorts of tests on her, decided she was healthy other than liver problems. We did xrays, blood tests, disease testing, chem panels...everything. The doctor talked to me like I was stupid for taking in a 13 year old sick bird and like I had no idea what was going on or how to properly care for my birds. She started gaining weight and seemed healthy for about a month (though she was still thin) and then we found her dead in her cage one morning. We did get a necropsy done, but I requested it be a different vet than the one who cared for her and that was the last penny that clinic got from me. And they still send wellness reminders for the other 2 birds that went there.
> 
> ...


Sorry it took so long for my response.. So busy lately. Anyway, that's horrible about your bird too! Did the necropsy find a reason for death? Yes, my main reason is to protect my birds.. But its also for piece of mind. I feel like if it's something I did or didn't do, I need to prevent it from happening again. 

My 2nd vet is just over 1 hr away. They are awesome. I mean she didnt get to see my bird well, but she was so knowledgeable and I could just tell she cared and wanted to help her. Unfortunately she couldn't. Plus she specializes in birds, and exotics.. So no barking dogs in the office. Its an awesome environment. The office has only been open about 6 months. 

I will be writing the letter or email, once I get the results from the tissue tests. Especially if it was something that could have been picked up on the tests. They had sent incomplete tests to the 2nd vet. I just want to know, so as someone said I can let them know what it was and if someone else's unfortunate bird ends up there, maybe they will remember my case.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

Frizzle said:


> Sorry to hear about your bird. : (
> 
> If I were you, I would make a google account, and write a "review" of the bad vets, with a link to the one you'd recommend. That way if other people are contemplating taking their birds there, they can see why not to. If you do, keep the points simple and write well so others will take your words seriously.


I will also do this for sure. Never thought about that, but its a great idea. A lot of people depend on those reviews. I will also write a good one for the new vet.


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## KriStellar26 (Nov 27, 2012)

cknauf said:


> I'm so sorry for the loss of your bird
> 
> Another reason to contact the vet would be if you found out the cause of death. Several years back we lost a wonderful 3-year-old dog after a severe, sudden-onset fungal infection (I believe it was Cryptococcosis) in her heart was misdiagnosed as a genetic deformity (the infection was causing the valves in her heart to pump abnormally). She was too weak to recover by the time we got a second opinion and the infection was correctly diagnosed. We contacted the first vet after she passed, and I can only hope maybe the vet learned from the experience and the next dog will get a better diagnosis. Vets don't know everything, and abnormal cases can't always be taught through a book. Maybe your tragedy can prevent one down the road.


Yes, I will do this for the sake of another bird who may end up there. It can only help!  Thanks for this suggestion!


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