# How to test Gender?



## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

So I found a cockatiel, a mate for Edward. Here are the following reasons the breeder I got her from had for saying she is female. She is 2 years old and she still has baring under her tail and grey on her face. Her main reason was, she had her, another female and 2 positive males in a cage. They were laying eggs, and the amount was too large for one female to lay alone. As in 2 in the time period it takes 1 female to lay 1 egg. So she said the other girl (who I now have) was female. So here's where I get nervous, she sings some. It hasn't been a lot so far, some squeaks and a few whistles, but she does know how to wolf whistle. I though while girls could sing, they could not mimic? Or is it just that they don't learn to talk, but rare ones do make more noise? Also, she is pied so I don't know if that makes the tail bearing have no affect on her real gender? :blink: She is so sweet, that I have decided if she turns out to be a boy that well, Edward will just have to live with a friend instead of a mate. 

*So I'm wondering what are the way I can have her DNA to be 100% positive? *

She didn't know the name she had before and I started calling her Bella, which if she is a girl will be her name, if she is really a boy, I'm worried she'll learned her name before I'm 100% and then well, she/he would be stuck with it. lol Unless I could then get her/him to learn a new name. I mean most of the older birds I've got haven't had names they seem to know, but I use them a lot when talking to them and they picked them up. She seems to understand that I'm talking to her when I say the name, so at least I got a smarty pants. lol


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## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

Is there spots under her wings? If not I have a feeling you might have a boy. I would get a dna test done to be sure, that way you can name her/him pretty quickly


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

Why would spots under the wings make it a girl?


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

Ok, I should have also mentioned her full mutation. She is a Single Factor-Dominant silver, pied, pearl.

I just read something that said males lose most if not all of the their pearl. However, she has pearling all over her, including cream pearling on her grey wings, and yellow pearling on the rest of her that is cream. No spots under the wings that I could see, however, some of her yellow pearling only show really well in certain lighting. 

Do that make a difference?


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

It would be very helpful if you could post a pix. Back view.

In regards to pearling I will post some general photo's of pearl pieds. Most males will lose the pearling over a couple years and each feather on the back will have a diluted center...whereas the hens pearling will not. (see pix)


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

srtiels said:


> It would be very helpful if you could post a pix.


I will take some pictures tomorrow and then hopefully that will help me figure it out.


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## atvchick95 (Sep 17, 2007)

if the bird you are thinking about getting is 2 years old and has bars on her tail - its a female Males loose the bars after their adult molt - start at 6 months usually all bars are gone by 1 

Which bird in your siggy are you unsure of being a female?

I can tell you the White face and Grey (back facing us head turned) are both males 

If the pearl on the left is over 1 - its a female 
also if the one on the right is over 1 it is a female 

or is it a bird not in your siggy?


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## Renae (Feb 9, 2008)

Tielzilla (I think her name is) has a female Cockatiel that sings and does the lot that males do - she only found out she's a female because she laid an egg - so it still is possible that she is a she. It's just VERY rare to have a female that whistles and etc.


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## *Tiel_Heart* (Feb 19, 2008)

My Minty does one whistle (like when you call a dog) and she is a WF pearl and has obtained them. She is a female, but she isn't chatty or talks much, just whistles when you do the whistle to her. 

Also ATV Chick, she said that the bird is a Silver Pearl Pied, and none of the birds in the signature are silver


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

_*if the bird you are thinking about getting is 2 years old and has bars on her tail - its a female Males loose the bars after their adult molt - start at 6 months usually all bars are gone by 1*_ 
----------------------------------------

With pieds you can throw the 'rule of thumb' out the window.

I was just checking my pieds yesterday and #4 is approx 8 yrs. old and a pearl pied. He still has the barred tail. And last is Houdini, a PF pied. he is approx 5 years old. He still has 1 barred feather and a solid feather from the most recent molt.

When pearl pied it takes longer to lose the barring to the tail feathers than a normal pied.


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## atvchick95 (Sep 17, 2007)

*Tiel_Heart* said:


> My Minty does one whistle (like when you call a dog) and she is a WF pearl and has obtained them. She is a female, but she isn't chatty or talks much, just whistles when you do the whistle to her.
> 
> Also ATV Chick, she said that the bird is a Silver Pearl Pied, and none of the birds in the signature are silver


i got confused, she was talking about 2 different birds lol or thats how i read it


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## atvchick95 (Sep 17, 2007)

srtiels said:


> _*if the bird you are thinking about getting is 2 years old and has bars on her tail - its a female Males loose the bars after their adult molt - start at 6 months usually all bars are gone by 1*_
> ----------------------------------------
> 
> With pieds you can throw the 'rule of thumb' out the window.
> ...


I keep forgetting when you mix pied in the scenario it changes things lol


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

_*I keep forgetting when you mix pied in the scenario it changes things lol*_
*-----------------------------------------*

LOL...Pieds don't play by the rules. But the nice thing about being on forums is over the past few months it has had me look harder at my birds...bith as babies and adults. And I discovered you can sex a pied when it is young providing it is a light pied or average marked pied. 

I have always looked at the wing spots on my birds, and started to check pieds. Same rule appies. If the long feathers (under the wing) closest to the body have dots a female, and if those last feathers closest to the body do not have dots then it is a male. BUT...when either sex goes thru a molt, many times the hen can lose the spots closest to the body, the same as an adult normal grey hen does. An adult grey hens underside of the wing will look like an immature grey male.

Right now I am studying feet and learning quite a bit, but want another year to test breed some birds to prove out what I am thinking. But there may be a way to also know if an adult normal grey is carrying other splits aside from pied.

It's amazing what our tiels can teach us 

Below are some undersides of tiels...

First is an adult hen, next an adult male, young pearl and a molting pearl male...and last shows the mottling that a pearl male will have for the rest of his life...some a little less, but always there.


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## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

So I guess these are a bit of bars on Spikes tail


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Good shot!...yes Spike still has some barring. When younger it was probably more contrasty. With each molt the barring will be less defined. He has the same light feather in his underside as my #4 (ran out of names) does... It may take several years for him to totally lose his barring on the tail feathers.


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

Ok, so I have pictures now, hopefully will help. She still has not shown any other male behaviors and she hasn't sung, so much as she wolf whistle a little and made some squeaking noise. She has been over all very quiet. So below are her pictures.She has about 3-4 tail feathers with baring, you can't see them all in the picture. The woman I got her from also told me that the reason her wing feathers have lighter color in them is that is the silver showing. However, someone else said it might look that way from her pearl growing out? I'm not sure. 









































































So now that you've all seen picture. What do you think?


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## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

I think he or she is a cutie


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## Lovin_the_tiels (Jun 10, 2009)

Heres another tail to look at,,this is the only bird i have that im totally baffled about,a pretty quiet bird,but does whistle,pied,almost 2,either way,,im waiting for it to get its groove on and breed,,LOLOL


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

_*She is a Single Factor-Dominant silver, pied, pearl.*_
*--------------------------------------------------*
Ok...from looking at the pix's you can rule out the bird being a Dominant Silver (DS) The colortine is wrong. With a hen it would be more of a brown tone to the dark feathers, and with a male it would be a dilute tannish grey where the dark toned areas are.

_*The woman I got her from also told me that the reason her wing feathers have lighter color in them is that is the silver showing. However, someone else said it might look that way from her pearl growing out? I'm not sure. *_

An inexperienced breeder, especially when trying to indentify mutations, is going to _*assume*_ that. But the info is totally wrong. Your bird is built like a hen, but has a males face. But, as to those solid colored feathers with the faded look to them, would be an indication molted out pearled feathers, and a male. In some instances a hen can display pearling like this, which is patchy and poorly defined in some areas.

How old is the bird? Some pearl pied males can retain a good amount of their pearling for several years. When molting it they start molting from inwards out. (meaning from the center of the back)

Keep those pix's and take another group 1 month from now and compare them to see if they are the same or changed.*


*


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*Lovin the Tiels...*

Fan the tail feathers out. Are the other barred feathers as light as the one showing? Also is you bird split to pearl?


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

xxxSpikexxx said:


> I think he or she is a cutie


The bird is a cutie, I would just prefer her to be a she. At this point, even if she is male, I'm keeping her/him. For having been a supposed breeder bird she is very sweet. Already sitting on my shoulder, learning how to step up, and giving kisses.


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

srtiels said:


> _*She is a Single Factor-Dominant silver, pied, pearl.*_
> *--------------------------------------------------*
> Ok...from looking at the pix's you can rule out the bird being a Dominant Silver (DS) The colortine is wrong. With a hen it would be more of a brown tone to the dark feathers, and with a male it would be a dilute tannish grey where the dark toned areas are.
> 
> ...


I'm not hugely suprised that she/he is not a silver. I was told she is at least 2, possibly 3, but no older than that. I wish there was a way to for sure age cockatiels. However, the woman I got her from, got her from another breeder. However if she did lay eggs as the woman claimed, then I would think she would be a little older, but I'm not sure. The woman said she was almost 100% positive it was a female, but as you said, she may not know as much as she claimed. Although so far, all behaviors seem to be female. :wacko: I will keep the pictures and take more in a month.


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

srtiels said:


> *Lovin the Tiels...*
> 
> Fan the tail feathers out. Are the other barred feathers as light as the one showing? Also is you bird split to pearl?


I took at look at her tail feathers. From what I've seen when she has it fanned out, they are a little darker and more defined, if I can get a pic to post I will. The woman told me the previous breeder did not keep great records and so she was not sure what she is split to. Would her being split to pearl make a difference?


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Sorry, my qiestion was posted for Lovin the tiels... OK...since you feel it is a she, then that rules out being split to pearl, since only males can be split to a sex-linked color. I had asked the question, thinking male, and many times when split to pearl the barring is slower to molt out.

As to your bird, the barring is pretty well defined....and it is a pearl pied. Not fully pearled on the back, but some pearl pied hens can have some patches that are not filly pearled or well defined in pattern. Since you are saying 2-3 years old then it is most likely a hen. Pieds can sometimes be so difficult to sex.

Oh...is the bird banded? If so, the year of hatch may be on the band. And hopefully a breeder code, and sometimes you can trace back to the original breeder for more info.


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## Lovin_the_tiels (Jun 10, 2009)

Hi Susanne,i will get butterball and take a new pict,its a bit of a wild child,so this will be interesting!!!Ill do it now....ok got em,,hes not that ''wild''just likes to be left alone ,OOOHHH,hes not happy at the moment,,LOLOL,heres a couple picts!!Thanks Susanne,i didnt meean to interupt this posting...Lisa
ps.He/she is a nice bird,but sooooo very independent!


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## BuddyD (Jun 4, 2009)

*OK! Now y'all have gone and done it.LOL*

After reading all this, even though UNO isn't a PIED all your post have made me wonder if UNO is the HE we think or if he is she ?

I also would love to hear what color mutation you more informed Tiel owners would call him/her?

You ,I am sure ,remember our scrawny little UNO ( look in the archives if not.LOL) ? Well Now UNO has bonded to me and I keep trying to get UNO to bond to my wife. However UNO thinks UNO belongs outside the cage and screams whenever UNO hears us in the other rooms and UNO isn't. The other day we had to close the utility door and turn off the lights to be able to use the phone. So UNO may not sing but UNO sure does make a lot of racket. LOL But all those comments about bars on the tales and spots on the wings sound exactly like UNO. UNO's dad is a gray that may have been split Pied or pearl when younger ( 8 years ago) so he has turned mostly Gray now. Sweetie UNO's mom was supposed to be Cinnamon Pearl But IMHO looks more like Just Cinnamon maybe split to pearl.( maybe you could look at the older photos of them to give a guess?)

But for now Look at UNO up close in these 4 PICS.

( the last attachment is the parents)


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

On the wing shot...if those last couple of feathers closest to the body have no spots on them then it may be a male. If those darker colored barred feathers are from a molt then again it is sugestive of a male. is the feather at the bottom of the point below the vent and right above the solid yellow feathers a solid grey feather? of so, a male.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Buddy...Poor UNO is going to be pissed at you. 

Can you take a pix of the underside of his wing? Full spread. And also a pix with his tail spread/fanned out. I'm calling UNO a 'him' because of the yellow coming in on the face...BUT that is not a 100% guarentee of male when young because some young females will also have alot of yellow on the face...but more where the feathers puff up around the beak and yellow that looks like eye brows.


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## Lovin_the_tiels (Jun 10, 2009)

Yupper,no spots next to the body,,we figured he was a boy,but he never ''talks''much,,,Thank You Susanne,,,,i just did the blacklight on my birds,,OHH SOOO PRETTYY,,MY lutinos are vivid yellow(heads)/purple haze(on back,and oh the little pearls,,i want picts like that,but im afraid the flash will kill the look!!!!,,Lisa


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Isn't the blacklight amazing!!! If you can get pix's that would be great. I tried years ago and could'nt get any. if your camera has a night time setting possibly it will work.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Buddy...I had to go quick to feed the babies. While I was doing them I thought of another sure fire way to find out the sex...and UNO looks old enough that it should work. BUT you would have to wait 2 weeks for the results.

Pull one of the yellow barred tail feathers. Straight out and a quick pull. Uno might squeek in surprise, but no harm done. In approx 2 weeks a new feather will start to come in. If it comes in barred and yellow it is a female. If it comes in dark to black and solid it is a male.

UNO looks like a normal grey. His father was light toned, and the mother cinnamon, which I have found has contributed to a lighter toned grey.


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## Lovin_the_tiels (Jun 10, 2009)

I am AMAZED to say the least and will check out my settings on camera,,all i can say is THANK YOU,,i have found another ''new toy''for playing with!!People,buy a blacklight and look at your birds!!


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## Kerry78 (May 25, 2009)

Another way to sex your bird is with the ring!
but this might not always be the case some breeders maybe wrong!

My Sandy has a Purple ring 09,
if it's on the left leg apparently it's a girl if right a male I don't know if it applys to other countries the same Ringing!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

By ring, do you mean leg band? If so, most tiels are closed ring banded and banded while young, most times before the breeder knows the sex of the bird. Some breeders are left handed or right handed which makes a difference which leg is banded.


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## Kerry78 (May 25, 2009)

Yeah leg banded, Sandy has a Closed ring on her left leg I presume she's female, she has alot of charractorisations like dots on the wings, stripes on the tail, but the thing is she's very young and all that can change!

she isn't very vocal can't mimic anything like Teallie but will have her own screeching moments 

if the bird hasn't got a Ring on the leg it's quite possibley microchipped!
Teallie may have this cos no Ring!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*Rarely* are tiels micro-chipped. If a breeder is going to go to the expence of a micro-chip, it only takes a little longer to surgically sex the bird.

Microchipping is more common with larger more expensive birds. And is invaluable when they are lost or stolen.

More than likely Sandy's breeder may have been left-handed.

Sandy just 'looks' female. Both are very nice tiels


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## Kerry78 (May 25, 2009)

Im pretty sure Teallie came from a petshop but he hasn't been ringed!
he quite possibley be microchipped but I don't really know, he's nearly
5 years old, 

I do think Sandy is female but i'll have to wait to see what happenes in the first moult


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

If he was micro-chipped they would have told you, had you fill out a form with your name and contact info, and give you a copy which would have the micro-chip # on it.

Shops are not going to go thru the expence of micro-chipping cockatiels. Many shops that buy tiels from breeders for resale will request the breeder does not band the bird. They do this so that a competitor can not get info from a band and trace it back to the breeder, which is also their supplier.


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## atvchick95 (Sep 17, 2007)

as for the leg bands being put on a certain leg - that is mainly bigger parrots who were surgically sexed then banded 

but all birds who were surgically sexed will have a tattoo (blue dot) up in the "pit" of their wing area 

My blue Quakers were surgically sexed at 3 months old The males tat is on the right, females is on the left


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## Kerry78 (May 25, 2009)

I didn't buy Teallie I got him of a friends mom she didn't want him anymore,
I was told her other son bought it her from a Petshop thats all I know really 
oh and his original name was "Percy" I changed that immediatley thought it was old and boring lol

I would love to trace Sandys breeder but I haven't a clue what the markings mean on her Ring, Im 50% sure shes a girl, I know a few of this forum have said shes a male it's all fun really waiting till the Moulting happens lol


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## Raven2322 (Mar 1, 2008)

srtiels said:


> Sorry, my qiestion was posted for Lovin the tiels... OK...since you feel it is a she, then that rules out being split to pearl, since only males can be split to a sex-linked color. I had asked the question, thinking male, and many times when split to pearl the barring is slower to molt out.
> 
> As to your bird, the barring is pretty well defined....and it is a pearl pied. Not fully pearled on the back, but some pearl pied hens can have some patches that are not filly pearled or well defined in pattern. Since you are saying 2-3 years old then it is most likely a hen. Pieds can sometimes be so difficult to sex.
> 
> Oh...is the bird banded? If so, the year of hatch may be on the band. And hopefully a breeder code, and sometimes you can trace back to the original breeder for more info.



No, she is not banded, normally I'd be happy about that, now I'm wishing she had been. I still believe she is a girl. She did sing a little tune today while she was sunning herself in my parents kitchen window. However, that's it. I have not seem one other male behavior, she doesn't act like any of the boys I have, but she does girl behavior. I would think it would be even more rare to have a boy that acts like a girl then the other way around. I'm still going to keep an eye on her behavior, and I think a DNA test will be in order sometime in the next 3 weeks. Depending on if my vet can do it, or if I have to send it away.


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## atvchick95 (Sep 17, 2007)

Females have a different tone to their "voice" then males 

here is one video of a female 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCs-RfMzG5c

does yours sound similar?


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## birdluv (Jul 31, 2007)

atvchick95 said:


> Females have a different tone to their "voice" then males
> 
> here is one video of a female
> 
> ...


woah, my tiel Jubejube sounds exactly like that. Now l'm almost sure she is a female.


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