# Artificial Incubation...?



## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

Well my tiels were sitting on 4 eggs originally (2 fertile, 2 infertile), so I pulled the infertile ones to prevent the tragedy of a rotten egg accidentally getting broken. They continued to sit on the two eggs for a week or so, until yesterday. Normally as soon as I uncover the cages, the female will come out of the nest and the pair will eat together, bathe, drink, preen, ect. then the male will take over and sit for the rest of the day. Well yesterday, he wouldn't go in and I could tell my little hen was getting aggravated with him. I waited a few hours, but I didn't want to let the eggs cool for too long, so I consulted my uncle and he said that where this is the first time they have been bred that it is possible the male lost interest in the eggs since they have been sitting for nearly 3 weeks. The eggs are nearing their hatch date so I placed them in my husband's cabinet incubator where he hatches his chickens and they seem to be doing okay. I can still see them moving inside the eggs. My only concern is hand raising the babies from day one, but my uncle says the babies take to it really well if brooded properly and kept warm. I got a heating pad and a thermometer for my formula and I'm just waiting for them to be born. Does anyone have any advice on feeding these little ones at such a tender age? My uncle has demonstrated how to handfeed, but that was with a 2 week old chick. 

Also, my cockatiel pair are still going in and out of the nest box. I know they are wondering where the eggs went, but I'm afraid of them not sitting on them if I gave them back. How long will it take for them to nest again? Should I be limiting their daylight to give them a break? Thanks!


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

We need srtiels in here, this question is too much for me to handle.

A better option than just removing eggs from the nest is to swap them out with fake eggs like the ones at http://theeggshop.com/ When eggs are removed and not replaced, the parents frequently respond by starting a new clutch to replace the lost one. Unfortunately it takes several days for online orders to be delivered. If you have anything handy that looks reasonably like eggs, putting this in the nest may reassure your birds (either that or scare them into not wanting to use this nest again right away!). I've heard of budgies sitting on white marbles but I don't know if that would work for a cockatiel.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

First thought...while nesting there is NO need to cover the cage at night. Part of your problem may be in doing that. Leave it uuncovered when they are nesting and a nightlight in the room.

What did you do with the 2 infertile eggs. if they were infertile them there is nothing inside them that was going to rot. The inside of the eggs are sterile and free of bacteria, when infertile, and the only way for them to turn bad is if there is a crack. Most infertile eggs just dehydrate.

if you still have the infertile eggs I would put those in the nestbox to see if they would go back to sitting the eggs. Once you atre sure they are taking turns then you can return the other 2 eggs.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

I like to cover the cage because the cock is prone to night frights. There is a lot of traffic on the road in front of our house and the headlights and loud ATVs scare him. I think my pair has begun to nest again. The male has begun to "work the nestbox" and the female is spending a lot of time inside during the day. If they don't do well this time, I will replace their eggs with the fake ones I bought and then separate them when they lose interest.

The female was sitting on the eggs at night religiously, and then as soon as I uncovered the cage the female would come out to eat and the male would go in to take over. I was alarmed yesterday when he wouldn't go in, despite all of the hen's attemps at trying to get him to sit on the eggs. I waited for hours on him to go in and he never did, so I really didn't have a choice because letting the unborn chicks chill and die would have been cruel! I think he got tired of sitting, because she laid her eggs kind of far apart and the first eggs were infertile and only the last two were fertile. They had been sitting for over 3 weeks so I think he just abandoned the nest, even though the hen didn't want to give up on the eggs.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

He probably gave up because he thought all the eggs were infertile and not because he was bored with them. The parents had been sitting for a length of time that's usually long enough for any fertile eggs to hatch, and we can't really expect him to understand that the eggs were laid on a more spread-out schedule than usual.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I have a incubated egg that just hatched. I've been watching it for a day because the air cell has been looking a little big (poor pix) When you chick hatches look at the abdomen. The intestines should be normal. If dark like mine it may be slightly dehydrated, which I suspected might happen since the air cell was big. But it hatched out fine, with a clean cut all the way around the shell and popped out with just a bit of shell still holding the top and bottom together.

When your chick hatches make note of the time and if you have a scales weigh it. This is your best guide as to if it is growing daily. It should gain it's hatch weight in the first 24 hrs....meaning if it hatched out at 4 grams, tomorrow the same time it should be 8 grams. 
Below is the notes I have just started.
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Hatch time: 7:30 AM
Hatch weight: 4 grams
Fed I drop of Lactated Ringers 1 hour after hatching. Give only fluids until the first feces is passed. If you do not have Ringers, I've included a recipe below. For the first few days you will also use this for the fluids to mix the formula.
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*Home Made Lactated Ringers*
Electrolyte solution for re-hydration​

　
*Mix the following in a jar:*
8 oz. of warm water
½ Tablespoon of sugar
1/8 teaspoon of salt
1/8 teaspoon of baking soda
Still well, and refrigerate. This solution is good for 2-3 days when mixed.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Leave the shell in the incubator so that the chick can prop against it. If it is a 1/2 shell, place the open side down. 

The chick will have a good feeding responce when the beak is touched or the head held. Feed 1-2 drops of warm Ringers/fluids. As the chick bobs and vocalizes place the syringe tip against the opening of the beak, watching the tongue to make sure it swallows. After each drop allow the chick to rest it's beak against a paper towel. This will blot off any excess fluid on the beak. If you look at the crop you can see the fluids in it. Do NOT feed more than shown. Too much and the fluids can go up the neck and aspirate the chick.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Another thing. You can warm up small amounts of fluids (and later foirrmula) by drawing into a syringe and placing the syringe in a bowl of warm (approx 105-6 degrees) water for a minute. The first feces will probably be seen an hour or two after hatch. It will be thin and watery. Since my chick was slightly dehydrated and had the dark intestines, when it passed solid feces it was dark. I will continue to give fluids every hour *or as* the crop empties until the intestines are normal color. I want the chick to pass out everything in the digestive tract first before I start on a very dilute formula.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

I checked on the eggs this morning since they are around 16-17 days, and one of them had external pip marks so I quickly put them down into the hatching tray and raised the humidity of my incubaor. I have it around 65% so that should be suffice. The eggs with the pip marks is the one that I had to repair with glue and a small piece of toilet paper about a week ago because the hen accidently cracked it, but it seems to be doing okay. Thanks for the advice on the home-made ringers solution, I'll mix it up before I go to work and check on the egg when I get home. I have everything ready for the little guy so now all I have to do is wait for it to cut out. Thanks for all of the advice! It is definitely much appreciated!!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Good luck with your eggs  Just move the one that is pipped down to the hatching tray. The one you repaired may be slightly dehydrated upon hatch. If so wait til it is active and check the abdomen. If dark looking I have found it takes about 4 hours (after 3-4 fluid feedings) for the intestines to be normal color.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Another advantage to weighing the chick upon hatch is from my personal experiences in a 24 hour time period they will double the hatch weight. So you have a base figure (meaning my chick) In 6 hours my chick gained 1 gram in weight. So this tells me that every 6 hours it should gain a gram. This info helps to let you know that the chick is doing fine. 

Since it has only been 6 hours since hatch I have been just feeding the Ringers. The next feeding I will make a very dilute formula...which I have Embrace on hand, but any formula should be fine.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

Just got home from work and still no chick. I can hear it inside the egg, but the external pip marks are still the same. If I have to assist it, I will but I'm going to give it a little more time to see if it can make it out on its own. I have assisted my husband's chicks from the shell before, but I like to wait until they are at least half way out and visibly struggling before I'll intervene. Hopefully by morning I'll have a beautiful little fluffy chick in the hatching tray! I have my brooder set up, my formula and lactated ringers ready, and my brand new gram scale up and running! All I need now is a baby!! 

OH!!! And by the way! My pair already has another egg in their nestbox and it has only been like 3-4 days since they abandoned the eggs I'm having to incubate now! They definitely don't waste any time!! Do you think they will be repeat offenders??


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Here is my article on assist hatching...just in case. http://justcockatiels.weebly.com/assist-hatches.html I have to soon redo it where all the pix's are below each group of info instead of links.

I just spent most of yesterday assist hatching a mousebird baby. To my horror while candling I applied too much pressure between my fingers while holding and the entire egg broke staight down the length of the egg...


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

If your pair is already starting the next clutch, that may have been why they abandoned the eggs you ate incubating. If the first eggs in the next clutch are fertile there should not be a problem, but if they are infertile this is going to delay time till the fertile ones hatch, thus them possibly abandoning the nest again.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

Well I read it can take anywhere from 24-36 hours for a chick to hatch once it has made the first pip marks. I checked on the eggs this morning and still no baby, but the second egg now has external pip marks as well. I have to work today so I'm hoping that at least one of them is here when I get home. Thanks for the article on assisting a hatch. I will avoid assisting for as long as possible, but I'm not going to let my little babies die in there! Oh and btw... the hen stayed on her new egg all night last night so I think she has begun to incubate already! She has not came out of the nestbox yet this morning to eat, but the cock keeps going in and out (possibly trying to relieve her?) I am not going to disturb them AT ALL unless I think something may be wrong. Once the babies are born, I'll weight them and keep an eye on them... and then eventually pull them at two weeks, but I'm not going to disturb their nest in any way right now!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I just thought of something that might be helpful. Get a variety of syringe sizes:

1cc is for chicks up to 10 grams
3cc is for chicks up to 30 grams
5cc is for chicks up to 50 grams
10cc is for chicks up to 100 grams.

***CC and ML are the same units of measure**

I have found it is *best to feed 10% of body weight per feeding* once you start the formula. This is an ideal amount because the chick will be getting the right amount of nutrients, and *no excess* which is the most common cause of health and crop issues. Also in doing this you will be greatly lessening the risk of an over stretched crop, which again can be very problematic.

cockatiel chicks are notorious in begging/crying for more food right after they are fed. Resist this. It usually takes a minute or two before they even realize they are fed. The formula goes into the crop which is a holding pouch. The crop has muscles that churn and deliver the food into the proventriculus. From there it goes into the intestines for nutrient absorption. It is when it reaches the intestines that the chick realizes it has been fed.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

Well the first egg to pip has hatch and it does have dark intestines. I gave it some lactated ringers solution, but it has some air in its crop, is that normal? And when will it start to beg for food? It is mostly just peeping and moving around now. I will have to take the chick to work with me tomorrow so that I can feed it every two hours, but I am going to put the brooder in a room where there is no a/c vents or drafts. I hope I am doing everything right b/c I really want this little guy to make it. I will probably be up all night feeding it and keeping an eye on it, but I will do anything required of me to make sure it is healthy! Thank you so much for helping me though this! I was so afraid when I took it out of the hatching tray! It is just so tiny and helpless! I was scared to death that I would hurt it!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Congratulations. The air in the crop may have been when the chick was swallowing...it would have swallowed some air if it is crying while being fed. In an hour or so it should be stronger and the feeding responce should be better.


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## kfelton0002 (Mar 12, 2010)

I have been up and down all night feeding my baby. He/she seems to be doing very well. The dark color in the intestine is gone and I've started him on a very thin formula. When I go to pick him up to be fed he begs and I think it's just the cutest most adorable little thing. The next time I feed him I will weigh him to see if he's gained any. He weighed 4 grams when he was born. Thanks again for all the help! You've been a life saver!


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