# If your birds are crazy territorial and don't leave their cage



## Rorschach (Nov 2, 2010)

what can you do?

They don't want me near their cage, as far as I can tell this is the big problem because when they are away from their cage they are practically angels. If something scares them or they decide to fly away from their cage for whatever reason the second they go away from their cage they are much more receptive to me.

They stop biting, they stop fighting, they step up on command, they don't mind me touching them so much (don't really enjoy it, but they don't nip at fingers either) but the second they get back to the cage they go right back to being ornery.

Is this just a territory thing? And if it is what do you do when they refuse to leave the cage/cage top except when frightened?

One of them either can't/won't leave the cage at all and the other doesn't let me pick him up (I don't really want to force the issue, but he doesn't like to be picked up) and if I put the cage near something else (like say make a ramp of branches onto a nearby table) he simply stays on the cage all day.

Is the cage itself the problem? Some unhealthy obsession with the cage that they've been forced to live in for 3 years? Their previous owners never let them out of the cage, or if they did let them out of the cage never let them get off the roof of the cage. What if I bought a whole new cage for them? Something they've never been in before, would this cage bound thing go away?


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

> What if I bought a whole new cage for them? Something they've never been in before, would this cage bound thing go away?


It might. Rearranging the interior of their current cage might help too. If they'll still be spending most of their time in the cage it will be their "safe spot" but they might be a little less demented amount it if it feels less like the cage that they're bound to.

It's also possible that they'll simply become more relaxed after they've been with you longer. You've had them for a relatively short time if I remember right, and it can take a couple of months for a bird to really start feeling comfortable in a new home.

If they're feeling at all hormonal this will contribute to the territorial urge. If you think they might be hormonal you could try some hormone reduction techniques.


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## Rorschach (Nov 2, 2010)

tielfan said:


> It might. Rearranging the interior of their current cage might help too. If they'll still be spending most of their time in the cage it will be their "safe spot" but they might be a little less demented amount it if it feels less like the cage that they're bound to.
> 
> It's also possible that they'll simply become more relaxed after they've been with you longer. You've had them for a relatively short time if I remember right, and it can take a couple of months for a bird to really start feeling comfortable in a new home.
> 
> If they're feeling at all hormonal this will contribute to the territorial urge. If you think they might be hormonal you could try some hormone reduction techniques.


2 weeks is relatively short yes, but I get frustrated that Chess won't come out of the cage (mostly because he sits in the cage and fusses LOUDLY for 1-2 hours every day, giving every outward indication that he wants to come out, but he doesn't).

I'd be okay if he just didn't feel safe coming out yet, but as it is he just sits in the cage and cries and I don't know what to do about it. 

I've been reading books on training cockatiels, particularly overly aggressive cockatiels like mine, and I'm confident I could make some progress if he was willing to come out of the cage and meet me half way, but you can't really force progress on the bird, and so far neither one of them has really given any inclination that they want to make any progress. Chess sits in the cage and Peak hisses at you if your hands come within a foot of him. 

Speaking of Peak I've been training him not to bite, and he's doing well, he figured out that if he doesn't bite my finger he gets millet, but he still looks very agitated when my hands are close and hisses, so I've stopped rewarding him if he hisses and now he only gets millet if he is quiet and doesn't bite. So we'll see how that works. 

The other day Chess freaked out for some unkown reason and left the cage (flew straight out the door) landed in the kitchen, I gathered the little guy up and took him on a 30 minute walk around the apartment, showing him things I think he'd find interesting, fresh veggies in the kitchen, paper to tear up on my desk, the mirror in my living room, and he seems to enjoy himself and likes being carried around. But 5 minutes after he gets back to the cage he seems to forget all of that and wants nothing to do with me again. So disheartening.

I've heard of a way to treat aggressive birds which sounds a little proactive than what I've tried before and may be worth a shot, you grab a towel and wrap the bird in the towel (this would be something more appropriate for peak than chess at the moment) so that just his head is sticking out, then you hold him in your lap and watch TV or something. Force him to sit still for half an hour with you, scratching his head the whole time and preening him. They say after a few minutes he stops struggling and after 10 minutes he'll start enjoying the time you're spending with him, sounds promising, may try it tomorrow but I'm anxious to hear what this forum thinks.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

> I've heard of a way to treat aggressive birds which sounds a little proactive than what I've tried before and may be worth a shot, you grab a towel and wrap the bird in the towel


This is a dominance-based method that is still used a lot by the general population, but it's frowned on by bird behaviorists as psychologically unhealthy for the bird. It basically teaches the bird that he's helpless to resist the owner so he may as well surrender and do what the owner wants.

Have you tried using a stick for step-ups? Birds who are afraid of hands are sometimes willing to step up on a stick.


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## Rorschach (Nov 2, 2010)

tielfan said:


> This is a dominance-based method that is still used a lot by the general population, but it's frowned on by bird behaviorists as psychologically unhealthy for the bird. It basically teaches the bird that he's helpless to resist the owner so he may as well surrender and do what the owner wants.
> 
> Have you tried using a stick for step-ups? Birds who are afraid of hands are sometimes willing to step up on a stick.


I tried it, but it's not a fear thing, it's an aggressive thing. They aren't afraid of my hands at all, they just don't want to be touched. They even hiss at millet if it comes too near too quickly and millet never hurt anybody!

Today went better anyway, fixed all the perches up in the cage (Chess loves to chew them, they're already pretty rough around the edges haha) and they seemed to be enjoying it (lots of hissing when they were going in though, but I think just ignored it and continued cleaning/mounting perches). Chess even came out of his own free will (though he had trouble finding the door to get back in later, haha) and I didn't even have millet on top of the cage. I think the new perches helped, I put one right in front of the door so it's easy to get in/out.

Peak was picking on Chess on top of the cage (I gave them a millet spray to chew on as a reward for coming out of the cage but Peak didn't want to share and kept picking on Chess) so I went to pick him up and put him back in the cage when he decided he wanted none of that and 'flew' 10 ft away into the kitchen area. He started doing the 'lost flock' call like they always do when they step away from the cage, and he walked back over to where the cage was (I had already accomplished my mission of getting peak to leave chess alone so I was just sitting and watching), took a few flapping jumps up in an attempt to get up, quickly realized he couldn't then he looked around until he saw me. He walked over to me and climbed ontop of my foot and just looked up at me, so I put my hand down and gave the step up command, he hopped right on like they always do when away from the cage (I gave him a millet reward for stepping up, eventually they're going to do it at the cage too...) but instead of bringing him back to the cage I set him down on my desk and let him explore. 

He seemed to enjoy himself for 10-15 minutes, exploring a new area before coming back to me and asking to be picked up, so I brought him back to the cage (Chess had finished the millet).

I keep hoping that these short explorations will eventually become enjoyable for them and they'll actually want to be with me out and around the apartment.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

It sounds like you're making serious progress! Making the cage seem less familiar was a good move.


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## Siobhan (Mar 21, 2010)

It sounds to me like what you need is a bit more patience. Keep trying without pushing too hard, so they'll get used to you and your hands and it will become familiar to them to step up from the cage. If they've been locked up for three years with minimal handling and time out of the cage, it's no wonder they're a little hesitant. From your description, you're making good progress, so don't get in a hurry. You have to win a bird over; it's not the work of a day or even two weeks.


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## Rorschach (Nov 2, 2010)

I've had a bit better behavior over the past 2 days so as long as I'm getting some progress I'm happy, I don't mind it taking far longer than two weeks, I was just frustrated by the seeming lack of progress, in fact it seems I had lost ground over those two weeks. it's better now though.


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