# is KALE dangerous?!?



## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

The guy I bought my tiel from is saying that it is dangerous to feed cockatiels kale because it causes a build up of gas and the bird cannot expel it?!?

I'm not finding this in google??

ANyone else hear this?!


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

i feed mine kale and they love it. i dont see any problems with it and ive never heard any problems with it.


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

I have never heard that. Kale is very healthy for them from everything I have read. My birds also love it.


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

RIGHT?! NO IM :censor: NOW... this breeder that I got Woody from is blaming me for his illness because I fed him Kale... he ate like BARELY ANY, mostly ate the apple slices. I can't find anything on the internet supporting what he's saying... I've also been feeding my keets kale for years with NO problems...

Just my luck the first breeder I meet is full of *#@&$!

I guess I'll stop with the kale anyways... but REALLY?!?! A pinch of kale and my poor bird gets THIS sick?! AHHH!!! 

I'm so frustrated right now... I miss my bird but I wish I went to a different breeder now.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

did you wash the kale before you gave it to him? or maybe the kale had pesticides on it?

how is he sick?


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

sry about the language... im just really worked up right now. i can't believe he's blaming me for this


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

i don't know whats wrong with him yet... the vet has him right now. He wasn't eating and he was throwing up

i did wash it... with vinegar too, rinsed that off of course too... and it was organic kale on top of that.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

you got him right?

well its possible the stress of a new home has brought out a hidden illness such as a yeast infection. it may not even be related to the kale.

perhaps the breeder should stop blaming you and check his birds for illness

theres also a slight chance that apples could have been contaminated with pesticide as theyre one of the fruits that are highly likely to have pesticides in them.


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## morla (Aug 15, 2011)

I heard Kale is very healthy for tortoises, so it must be healthy for cockatiels!


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

I don't think his illness has anything to do with anything you fed him. Either he had an illness he was hiding before you brought him home, or the stress of moving caused an imbalance in his normal GI flora, and that made him sick. It sounds like the breeder is making things up to try and deflect blame.


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

THanks guys... really thank you so much. I've been beating myself up pretty bad over this- it's really depressing me. I love this little guy so much I want nothing but the best for him!!

Everything I give my birds is either home grown (NO pesticides) or from the organic section at the grocery store. I thoroughly wash everything with vinegar and water...

This guy started bashing my vet too, saying that the people he worked with at a pet store said some bad things about him. I don't exactly trust what people at pet stores say anyways... no offense to anyone that works at one- I've ALWAYS wanted to work at a pet store, but theres not alot of them in my area.

All I've heard are good things about my vet...

I think I'm just going to look at the bright side and be happy that I got Woody out of that place, because I don't think this guy really cares as much as he claims to.

I will keep posting on Woody's condition, I'll call them tomorrow to see if he's looking/feeling/eating any better.

I disinfected EVERYTHING in/on and around the cage to be safe... and I'll probably avoid giving HIM kale, but my keets have had it for years just fine, so they'll still get it every once in a while, i guess... i just want to scream. All I wanted was a friendly pet bird >.< but a happy healthy one at that.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

ignore him, he doesnt sound like he knows much. i want to suspect a yeast infection, but as long as he is in vets care, he should get better  if YOU trust the vet, thats all that matters. it does not matter what the breeder says, hes just trying to make you feel guilty. you are right to take Woody to the vets. You are doing everything right.


theres nothing wrong with kale, its good for your birds. its high in calcium and vitamin A.


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

I really feel for you in all of this. It's hugely traumatic having a sick bird, let alone having some idiot breeder then try to blame it on you. 

You did nothing wrong. You brought Woody into a loving home, and you offered him a very healthy diet. Whatever made him sick happened in spite of this, not because of it. Most importantly, you noticed when he needed medical care, you got him to the vet, and you came here to learn all you can about how to help him. He knows that, and he knows that you love him. 

It sounds like this breeder wants to blame anyone and anything but himself -- you, the vet, the food. That just makes him irresponsible. If anything, he should be offering his assistance right now, not criticism. 

Please try to accept that you've done everything you can for now, and you need to take care of yourself, too. Make sure to rest and eat. Maybe do something nice for yourself, like have a cup of tea or hot chocolate if that's your thing. You and Woody have all of us pulling for you.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

Kale is fine, but the way this breeder is acting makes me suspect that he sells a lot of sick birds and goes into "the best defense is a good offense" mode when somebody complains. He's bad-mouthing the vet so he can blow off the diagnosis if the vet says the bird was sick before you bought it.


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## Spikers (Oct 13, 2011)

Something like this happened to me and my Parrotlet Rogue... I had him for nearly 6 months before he started having seizures. I took him right away to a 24 hour animal hospital where there was a avian vet staffed there 24/7. After putting him on oxygen and giving him some phenobarbital they told me that he had some sort of toxic poisoning... I was so upset because I thought I had done this to him. But I found out after a necropsy that he had been sick long before I got him. I went back a few days after his passing and found out that all the birds that the store had received had all died around the same time as Rogue and they all had the same symptoms. They never again got birds from that breeder again.


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## DesertDweller (Oct 8, 2011)

It's awful what some breeders or bird dealers do. I remember when I was a new manager at Petsmart our birds came in from a big breeding farm. A couple of days after they got to our store, several of them showed symptoms of bird pox. I contacted the breeder and they told me 'well the birds looked perfectly fine when they left here...'. They absolutely refused to accept responsibility. And, many of our birds died from this awful disease. We also got in numerous birds that had been injured in shipping and had fractured necks. The birds were carelessly packaged for shipping. 

Same problem with our fish. Can you imagine $3,000.00 a month in fish deaths - not including customer returns???? And, 90% of the birds died that came into the store. All this was BEFORE I became manager. 

I did a heck of a lot of research and ultimately was able to turn these bleak statistics around.

Regarding kale, it's a good food for birds. My practice is to make a big salad which includes a variety of veggies and a small amount of fruit. I feed this salad to my tortoises, iguana and my birds. I also eat it. 

Variety is the key. Feeding exclusively kale is not something I would recommend.

And, regarding bleach, my research disclosed that bleach is the strongest disinfectant. But the reason it is not used institutionally is because it has NO residual effect. As far as I'm concerned, if you rinse anything well, you're getting rid of the residual effect anyway. So, I always turn to bleach to disinfect. If you are worried about how thoroughly you rinsed something washed in bleach, simply let it dry. The bleach will be gone.


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## Spikers (Oct 13, 2011)

But I thought even the SMELL of bleach can cause death to a bird...


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

diluted bleach is a good disinfectant, but it should not be used with the birds right there sort of thing. the smell can pose problems for birds if not diluted and if it is used close to birds


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## Spikers (Oct 13, 2011)

Oh ok. I had used bleach to mop my floors but he was outside it the house aired out some before I let him back in.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Strong bleach odors can be an irritant to the birds lungs.....so it is best to remove them from the source of the smell. If anything is washed with bleach the easiest way to dissipate the bleach residue is to either allow the items to be dried out in the sunlight....or indoors use a full spectrum or sunlight or plant grow light for 1/2 hour.

As to Kale it is not harmful to birds. It sounds like the breeder is just making excuses....which is a shame because their indifference puts not only your bird at risk, but their own birds if they have an existing problem.


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

thanks again, so much, for all the input/advice you guys!! I got Woody back today, he seems much better! He's chirping A LOT more and isn't sleeping constantly... he even nibbled on his food a little bit already!! 
Things are looking good!  As for the breeder... well I haven't emailed him back yet in response to him blaming me for Woods sickness because I fed him a TINY amount of kale, along with some apple too. I feed a variety of greens to my keets along with apple and shredded carrot (all 'organic' stuff)... that's what Woody will getting too, now that he's actually eating again!

I want to yell at this guy, or chew him out for making excuses and saying that his birds are just fine (being ignorant to the fact that they may be sick too) and blaming me... but I almost find it useless. 

Should I reply to him about kale not being dangerous and him being a *poo* head?? Or should I just let it go... I don't know, I don't like arguing with ignorant people!!


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

i would let it go. hes not worth it 

you got woody back, hes in good hands, so why argue?


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

RIght?! That's what I'm thinking... I'm not the type to be a huge jerk, even if I should be. So I think I'll let it go... I still think he's full of you know what though.

Woodys in great hands... I am in love with him and I hope to spend many many long years being his best friend... glad to be apart of this community too


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

I'm so glad he's doing better! Did the vet tell you any more about what they think is wrong? I'm just always curious about these things. 

I agree with Dally on the breeder. You did your part notifying him, and if he's not going to step up and take responsibility, then that's not your problem.


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

My vet didn't charge me at all for the treatment he gave to Woody. He said that alot of birds have underlying infections that come out once the bird is moved to a new home... which is what happened to my Woody- since the antibiotics had a positive affect on him.

I'm more than satisfied since Woodys shown a great improvement, he's livelier than he was the first night I had him before he started acting ill... He's eating right now, ravenously...as a bird would, as I type- which makes me sooo happy!!

Doc Reed said that if there's no improvement then bring him back in... but there's improvement... so I'm happy. I have a good feeling this guy knows what he's doing, probably seen alot of this type of thing.

I'm happy Woody's happy.... EXCEPT doc reed/ Trisha his assist. said that he may be a girl... but I think it's too young to tell. If so... name's changed to Wudee(WOO-dee).. Deedee for "short"... it's more girlyish!


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

He sounds like an excellent and very compassionate vet.  

And his diagnosis makes sense. I've been battling some kind of infection with Roo pretty much since I adopted her in August. It can be hard to turn them around when they come from an unfortunate background, but it's so worth it! It sounds like you and Woody will have many happy years together.

P.S. We also thought Roo was male. Her name was Rupert when I adopted her.


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## amy86 (Oct 6, 2011)

He is an excellent vet... I'll keep him! !!

Woo is playing in his cage and at the same time begging to come out as I speak, all happy-like!

My boyfriend, who isn't much of a pet person, is already in love with Wood too... saying things like "maybe we should get another cockatiel.... so woody doesn't get lonely!"... it's not like Jake(my bf) to say things like that- he's in love too  
Although I think it'll be awhile if I get another one... for now, WOod's enough!!!


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