# Difficulty Training



## dianne (Nov 27, 2013)

Hi.

I've had Emma for just over six weeks. She is fully flighted and about five months old. I got her from a pet shop, where she was in a small cage by herself.

I've been trying hard with her. I've been using millet, sitting by her cage, talking quietly to her, and giving her toys to play with. She had gotten to where she would step up on my forearm to get millet. She would take treats from my fingers, as long as I didn't try to touch her.

She likes being out of her cage. She will fly around the living room, then perch on top of the cage and play with her toys. Or, she sits in the doorway sleeping with her head tucked in her wing and on one foot. So, I'd say, she is definitely a bird who prefers to be out rather than in.

A couple of times recently I have had trouble getting her back into her cage. I've offered her millet to step up onto a perch to return her to her cage and tried putting millet in her cage, to no avail. I ended up having to chase her and catch her in a towel--twice in the last week.

Now, she won't do anything for me. Won't step up; won't take treats from my hand.

I have her in a cage next to my budgies' flight cage. She seems to like being in with the budgies. However, I'm trying to keep her in her own cage, in hopes that she will be easier to tame.

Do you think I would be better off not letting her out until she is reliably finger tamed? Do you think I should take her in to have her wings clipped? Any other suggestions?

I am feeling very discouraged. Thank you for any help you can provide.


----------



## Twitter09 (Dec 14, 2009)

I would definitely avoid ever chasing her and catching her with a towel. That probably terrified her and may have un-done all the progress you had. So you may have to start back at square one with taming. I don't know if I'd recommend wing-clipping. I personally don't like it but taming a flighted bird can be slightly harder since they can "vote" with their wings (i.e. fly away), if they don't like something. My approach has always been to be slow and calm around my birds and wait them to come to me, when they are out of their cages. But it is good to get them finger-tame inside their cages first. I'd give up trying to pet her for now because, if she doesn't like it, you could be just annoying her and slowing down her taming.

One trick to free flight time is to do it late in the day so it gets dark and she will want to go back in their cage. The other thing is, don't offer any food outside her cage - except millet spray on your hand. This way, she will go back in her cage when she is hungry. Lastly, just relax when she is out and let her go back to her cage when she is ready. Is it possible, she is so new to her environment that she doesn't know how to get back in her cage on her own? If not, it's very important that she figures out how to do that on her own - because almost all cage birds will want to go back to their cages eventually, for food and security. The worst thing you can do is chase her around to get her back in the cage. Better to wait until the room gets dark and she will probably just step on your finger so you can put her back. If she can't stay out until "dusk", when she will go in more easily, maybe don't let her out that day.

I have 3 parakeets that love to fly around and explore my house. But I usually only let them out in mid to late afternoon and by the time it starts getting dark, they are all mostly back in their cages, without me having to do anything.


----------



## caterpillar (Oct 14, 2013)

Twitter09 said:


> I would definitely avoid ever chasing her and catching her with a towel. That probably terrified her and may have un-done all the progress you had. So you may have to start back at square one with taming. I don't know if I'd recommend wing-clipping. I personally don't like it but taming a flighted bird can be slightly harder since they can "vote" with their wings (i.e. fly away), if they don't like something. My approach has always been to be slow and calm around my birds and wait them to come to me, when they are out of their cages. But it is good to get them finger-tame inside their cages first. I'd give up trying to pet her for now because, if she doesn't like it, you could be just annoying her and slowing down her taming.
> 
> One trick to free flight time is to do it late in the day so it gets dark and she will want to go back in their cage. The other thing is, don't offer any food outside her cage - except millet spray on your hand. This way, she will go back in her cage when she is hungry. Lastly, just relax when she is out and let her go back to her cage when she is ready. Is it possible, she is so new to her environment that she doesn't know how to get back in her cage on her own? If not, it's very important that she figures out how to do that on her own - because almost all cage birds will want to go back to their cages eventually, for food and security. The worst thing you can do is chase her around to get her back in the cage. Better to wait until the room gets dark and she will probably just step on your finger so you can put her back. If she can't stay out until "dusk", when she will go in more easily, maybe don't let her out that day.
> 
> I have 3 parakeets that love to fly around and explore my house. But I usually only let them out in mid to late afternoon and by the time it starts getting dark, they are all mostly back in their cages, without me having to do anything.


My birds panic when they think they're getting chased, and I agree, it's a big step back in the taming/bonding process. Thankfully, mine also eventually fly straight back to their cage when they're out and about, so even though their wings have grown out now and we're likely going to keep them that way, they haven't yet gotten problematic about escaping and getting to places where we can't get them back easily.

That said I do understand this problem and I would support the idea of clipping a bird who has "escape artist" tendencies *only for the taming process* and then see if things are better when the wings grow back out. In our old house, our ceilings were much higher, and when the birds were flighted there were places they could get to where it could take an hour or more to retrieve them. Some people also don't have the option to be selective with the time of day for taming or out-of-cage time.

So yeah, I agree clipping isn't ideal (it's made my birds fat and lazy!) but I think in this context it's understandable to do it once.


----------



## dianne (Nov 27, 2013)

I appreciate the advice from both of you.

Yes, she does know where her cage is and how to get back to it. She had been returning to her cage on her own without a problem for about two weeks before the latest two incidents. I would let her out in the morning and then again in the afternoon. After an hour or two she would go back in. If she as reluctant, I would put millet in her cage and that would do it. That was a previous suggestion I got on here.

To my surprise, the other night when Emma wouldn't go back on her own (she was perched on top of her cage), I turned out all the lights except the night light near her cage. When she didn't go back in, I tried to get her to step up onto a perch. She quickly backed away, climbed to the top of the budgie cage, and played "catch me if you can." I was shocked when she then started flying around the room in the dark : (. She would then land back on top of the cage. When I came toward her with the perch, she took off again. I tried turning off the nightlight, and she still flew away. That's when I resorted to a towel. She shrieked and got very scared. I felt terrible, but didn't feel it was safe for her to be out of the cage overnight.

I will think about taking her to the vet for a clip after New Years, when there is a little more time and not so much holiday stuff going on. I am reluctant to do it. She so much enjoys her free flight time first thing in the morning and in the evening.

I'm afraid that if I don't let her out she may turn into a screamer.

She was a quite a bit better this morning. I've been trying to clicker train her, in the hopes of eventually getting her finger tamed. After I was away for two days over Christmas, she refused to have anything to do with the target stick or any treats from me. However, this morning she nipped the target stick five times and accepted a sunflower seed each time from my hand.

I'm usually pretty good at training. I've trained my to budgies to be finger tame, to target on a stick, and to pick up small objects.

As I'm thinking about it more calmly this morning, I feel perhaps I have been overstressed with the holidays and this has communicated it to Emma.


----------



## caterpillar (Oct 14, 2013)

dianne said:


> As I'm thinking about it more calmly this morning, I feel perhaps I have been overstressed with the holidays and this has communicated it to Emma.


That's definitely possible. Both my tiels and my cat can pick it up when I'm extremely stressed. Except that Kitty gets cuddly, and the tiels just scream more and more


----------



## Twitter09 (Dec 14, 2009)

I should point out - I don't have a Cockatiel right now and I am basing some of my taming advice on my more recent experiences with my 2 Bourke's Parakeets and 1 Scarlet Chested Parakeet.

Bourke's Parakeets are about the size of a budgie but way more laid back. They take a while to bond with people but they eventually do and have a very gentle personality. The Scarlet Chested is more flightly and harder to tame. With my keets, I made the decision that I'd rather have them fully flighted - because I have 2 dogs and I didn't want them to be vulnerable. It has worked out pretty well - they are all very skilled fliers and never crash into anything. The dogs leave them alone for the most part and the parakeets know to fly away if the dogs get too close. And also, the parakeets all know how to fly back to their own cages, which is nice. For some reason, none of these parakeets have ever done the "curtain rod" thing - where they fly high up and out of reach. They land of the backs of chairs, on my mantelpiece, on their bird cages, or the floor. I don't know it's because I am not threatening or they just don't seek high places?

I'm on the Cockatiel Forum because I am considering a Cockatiel. I was told a Cockatiel would be better as a friend for my "non-Budgie" Parakeets than an actual Budgie, which might be too aggressive.

Here is one of my Bourke Parakeets. This is "Twitter" a rosy (pink) Bourke.




And this is "Elvin", my current Scarlet Chested. He is fully-flighted and not scared - but he isn't really finger trained. He will sometimes land on my arm or shoulder, especially if I have a millet spray.


I had this Scarlet Chested Parakeet, "Peeper" in the past, and he was very tame and fully flighted.


----------



## dianne (Nov 27, 2013)

Wow! Those are really beautiful birds! When I first saw the last one I thought it was a rainbow lorieet.

Things have been much better with Emma the last two days. I'm very pleased. She's still not finger tame, but will come onto my forearm, if there's something in it for her (millet). I think you are right--Never Chase Her--always, always find a Better Way, even if it takes a long time.

I do notice that my budgies are much more aggressive and assertive than Miss Emma. I have two cages. Emma often likes to be in the budgie cage, even tho she has her own. However, if they want to be someplace where she is, she will back up and yield to them. This morning I gave her a sunflower seed. One of my budgies swooped in and tried to take it away from her. And, they don't even eat sunflower seeds! She ended up dropping it, so neither one got it. I gave her another one and picked the budgie up while she ate it. They haven't bitten her or anything like that. I do keep an eye out, just in case. It's funny that the smaller birds are more feisty and assertive

Emma has a bowl of toys on top of her cage. She picks them up and drops them over the side onto the floor. They go bang! The budgies decided that would be fun. So, they came over. She backed away, and both budgies were perched on the toy box for a few minutes. Then, they figured out the toys were too big for them and flew off. Then she came back and played some more.

So, that's my experience of the two species.


----------

