# Advice on stunted babies please



## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

i have 2 stunted babies oneis 10 days old and one is 12 days old they weigh 11 grams as of today, i am feeding 1cc every 2hours, one baby still feeds at the 2 hour mark but one fights the feeding and is hard to feed should i be worried cause basically he's only eating the full 1cc every 4 hours. I cant say for sure which one is fighting the feeding every 2hours and in this picture you will see why.


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## nkeith2 (Feb 6, 2011)

Aww, I really wish I could help you out but I really don't know too much on the subject. It is strange that the one is fighting every other feeding but at least he is still eating which is a good thing  I hope someone who knows more about stunted babies can come on and help you out


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## Mentha (Jul 11, 2010)

He may be ready to graduate, try feeding him every 3 hours. Is he the older one?


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

I honestly dont know but will definately try him at the 3 hour feedings, what else can i do.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

For those of you that care, babe was still around at 7am, but i expect to loose him soon as i cant even pry mouth open to give a drop.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Yikes! If you can not pry the mouth open, then there is a good chance that the baby may have lock-jaw, which can also inhibit the growth when young. 

The only way to feed these type of chicks is to tube feed them with a tiny flexible tip extender: http://www.innovetpet.com/products3cbig.php

They will also have to be medicated. You can start with the spice remedy:
Recipe for the Spice Recipe







 
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*Take a small jar and mix thoroughly the following, which the base stock:

**2 tsp. of garlic powder *(*not* garlic salt)

*1/2 tsp of cinnamon

1/2 tsp. of ginger

*There are several ways that I will use to treat. If it is a single bird or just a couple I will mix up a small solution and either give orally or use a small crop tube and feed directly into the crop.

*I will mix 1/8 teaspoon of the spice mix with 2cc of water.* (*Optional* a pinch of Probiotics or Yogurt, and Brewers Yeast can be added if the baby appears pale or stressed)

Each chick is given a 1/2cc (*.*5cc) 2 times a day for 5-7 days.

If I am hand feeding a lot of babies I will mix *¼ teaspoon PER ½ cup of formula *2 times a day.

This combination of spices will help cut down on the yeast and bacteria by means of inhibiting overgrowth while boosting the immune system, and providing nutritional and supportive care to the digestive tract, body and organs. The spice remedy is designed more as a *supportive treatment* rather than for any antibacterial or antifungal properties. The dosage is too low to be truly effective as a stand alone antibiotic treatment. 

You will also have to order some meds online: 
http://www.allbirdproducts.com/newproductpages/amtyl.html
http://www.allbirdproducts.com/newproductpages/ronivet-s.html

It would be best to treat all the babies in the clutch.

I can't phone because we are on disability and SS, and our phone is disconeccted until the next SS check comes in ​


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

i gave him the spice mix last night, because i thought it would help, thanks susanne, i will have to make do with what i have, i only have child tax to live on, so i dont have a credit card to order meds online. i have adminstered the spice mix, i did it at the last feeding as i figureed i would try to get something into him, and he ate the 9 pm feeding without much fight, his crop is fine, at least to my untrained hand, ive been massaging the crop before every feeding, so that i might hope to pick up the smallest change, i just dont understand, the otherone is alert and begs for food,and this one was that way until yesterday afternoon, i weighed this moringin and the one refusing food is 13 grams, and the other is 12 grams, i dont know what to do, i dont have any money until tomorrow and that doesnt help me now.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Look at the eye shape of the other chicks. I quick put some pix;s in a group....of what you do not want to see. The shape of the eye going from round to chinese is the first indications, and then the jaw starts to tighten up and the head gets a buldgy look. Antibiotics, the spices, and tube feeding are about the only way to save the bird.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I feel bad because when I looked at your pix I thought there was a problem...BUT I also thought I was being paranoid and just didn't say anything.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

ya, thats what he looked like yesterday, his eyes are closed today, but what causes it, i mean the other one is still alert and ate its food i will definately keep a close watch on this one, but i dont understand what causes it.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

I'm not sure either. Ususally the time for lock-jaw is from Nov-Apr. 

Since I live in the south and most of our seed is silo stored I stringly suspect that the seed is treated with strong presservatives and this in turn can interfere with a young chick immune system that is being being fed by the parents. When the immune system is compromised secondary bacterial infections can start. One of the most common one is klebsiella (sp) Another cause is an unsupected giardia infection with the parents, or local water being contaminated with protozoa/giardia and fed to the babies.

It is a nasty illness, and if not alert to the first sings and what to do then there can be 100% mortality. If caught in time it is treatable, but takes several weeks, and is not something that inheriteed and passed to the nest generation.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

As to all the other ones. The *first thing* before you feed is to fully open and close their mouths several times to make sure the movement is good and they don't resist like they are in pain. Also watch the eye shape....what you want is bright round eyes.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

Thanks Susanne, im gonna give it a bit and then ill try treating it like a newborn and give it a pedyalyte mixtue with spice mix through side of mouth as it hasnt really eaten since 11pm and im not sure if i should be worried about dehydration, also i dont know if i should seperate from siblings as they keep eachother warm, i had removed the older 3 and left 2 with them but the lack of bodyheat made my brooder drop in temperature, dont ask, it never dropped when pico was in there, so i placed them back in.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

susanne the other chicks as soon as they see the syringe look like fish with mouth wide open.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

nwoodrow said:


> susanne the other chicks as soon as they see the syringe look like fish with mouth wide open.


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*Still*...do the mouth check and watch the eyes. Hopefully it may be only the one baby affected.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

Will do susanne, thanks for your help, im gonna due what i can with the little one, but at this point ide rather take the chance of aspirating it then not doing anything.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

Well i got the baby at least half a feeding using the pedyalyte and spice mix, once i got beak open i was able to get feeding response from him, after being fed i used a q-tip with hot water and swabbed inside of mouth to clean any food up but it was clean so i know it all went down, i just have to figure out how to get it to eat, and then if its eating, even as a newborn, hopefully i can find substitutes to those meds hear in canada that i dont have to order online.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

nwoodrow, can you sign up for paypal? You can connect it to your account that way you don't need a credit card to order things online. Although not all sites accept it some do...


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

I had a paypal account once, but if i have the money for the meds ide rather run to the local bird vet than wait until it gets delivered. that and of the money that comes in tomorro we have 90 bucks after bills, and i hate tht it takes like 24hours for the transfer of money to be acknowledged, im gonna phone the vet today and see if we get that med here and find out if i can ge some.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

OK...if you can get the meds from your bet...IR if he will phone in a prescription to the pharmacy...what I would suggest is that you ask for *Keflex*. This med will also work too because respiratory problems are a secondary problem with this illness. Ask the vet for Flagyl (also know as metronidazole)

I just installed a magic Jack, and the portable phone is still charging...so I PM's you the phone #


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

Well im just waiting for the vet to call back, so i can confirm i can get those 2 meds, for the little guy, i will have to borrow money from my grandma until tomorrow but well its better than nothing.


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

For those that have tried your best and given advice, i just wanted to let you know that babe passed away at 320pm today, other babe is doing good and no others have shown symptoms, i can only hope for the best with my others that they stay healthy.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Aw I'm sorry hun, you did try your best it was just his time.


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## mitch2006 (Jan 15, 2011)

sorry to hear about your loss nwoodrow
wishing good health for rest of your clutch
glad also to hear you did call your other baby Piccolo thanks
best of luck


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## nwoodrow (Feb 13, 2011)

yw mitch2006, he suits it.


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## Swtbbgrl (Mar 28, 2011)

Awww so sorry to hear I was reading yesterday (could be of no help) was hope for the best for you and baby....I know you tried really hard. wishing you good health and happiness with the other Little ones...


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## Mentha (Jul 11, 2010)

Sorry to hear you lost the little one. It hurts when you lose a little one you're fighting to keep alive.


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