# OMG! Now what do I do?



## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

I have what I thought was a male and female. Chester and Lucy. Then Chester started to lay eggs. Well, he's been HE for over a year so I still call them him and her. Easier to know which one I'm talking about.
Anyway, I haven't had the care of cockatiels for a long time. About 30 years ago we had 4 and I wasn't that closely involved with all the intricasies. (sp)
Over the last 8 months Chester has laid 5 clutches. Usually 5 eggs each. This last clutch is 11 eggs. I am 99% sure that all the eggs are Chester's not Lucy's. I don't watch them continually of course. And all but 4 were laid in his cage. And the ones laid in Lucy's cage I picked him up off of.
I've gotten books on cockatiel care. I have read everything I could online, I have asked questions till I'm blue in the face. Some advice I have used and greatly appreciate. But there is so much information that sometimes I find it hard to decide which infor/advice to follow.
I found out that the aviary that we bought from 30 years ago is still in business. My mom and dad trusted them, so I thought I'd go and ask them for advice. The woman I spoke with-you know that look that you get when in your head your saying idiot-that is the look she had. I even said you're looking at me like I'm and idiot. She didn't deny it or even smile at me. 
She told me that there is no way Chester laid 11 eggs. That I should take all the eggs away and try reducing the light, had no idea what I meant when I mentioned birds know how many eggs they lay and will replace the ones you take, said that medical treatments are expensive and don't work, that I should try to "shake him up" to get him to stop laying, and that I shouldn't believe anything I read on the internet. I also mentioned reading about a man that almost lost his hen to chronic laying and she stopped after they let her foster a fertile egg. She thought that was ridiculous-Where would I get a fertile egg, and how would that make a difference to the laying. 
This was my last hope. I'm really out of ideas about what to do. I'm going to take out the 7 eggs that he is ignoring and let him set on the four he's sitting on. When he's done with these I'll try to find something to use as a grate on the floor and that's it. I don't know what else I can do.
Sorry about how long this is. I was going a little crazy with all this and had to let it out. Thank you to everyone who has given me advice.


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## RexiesMuM (Sep 7, 2011)

If your at home techniques don't work to stop Chester from laying you need to talk to a vet about other options to help Chester stop laying


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

> that I should try to "shake him up" to get him to stop laying


This is basically what we've been recommending by changing the amount of darkness a night Chester gets and rearranging the cage. You have to shake up the environment. Because she has an aviary she probably doesn't watch her tiels as closely as we watch ours.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

He just laid his 12th egg.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Susanne used to have a hen that wouldn't stop laying until she laid 40-something eggs each clutch. So 12 eggs is very possible in one clutch. If giving more dark hours doesn't work, you may do the opposite and keep a dim light on for all hours of the day and see if that works.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Doesn't everyone says that you shouldn't give your hen anyplace that is dark because they like to lay there? Wouldn't keeping him in reduced light make him want to lay?

By the way-He was totally ignoring 7 of the eggs, so I took them out this morning. Right now he's sitting on 5. He has been horrible to Lucy today. Chasing her and once he flew straight at her and landed on her. Lucy's ok but feathers flew.


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## Mentha (Jul 11, 2010)

Cockatiels lay by the amount of daylight they get, longer daylight hours mean spring is here and it's time to breed. The longer the day the more likely they will lay, they do not lay during the winter (shorter days). You need to trick Chester into thinking it's still winter, this will cool her jets and she will be less likely to continue. Cut back on the green food and give her longer nights. Your only other option after that is getting a shot from the vet, this can be expensive and dangerous if done wrong. Try the longer nights and rearranging her cage first.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Susanne thinks that covering the cage makes it seem more of a nest box since it is dark and private...another suggestion is to do the opposite; keep a dim light on for 24/7. I'm not sure of the reasoning behind it, but it's worked for some hens to stop egg-laying. You should really try all options before getting the Lupron shots from the vet.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

14 th egg this morning.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

> Susanne thinks that covering the cage makes it seem more of a nest box since it is dark and private


There's an article that Susanne cites sometimes at http://www.holisticbirds.com/pages/chronicegg0503.htm where it says:



> In addition, if acted upon incorrectly, the recommendation to reduce photoperiod actually could have the unintended effect of encouraging laying. In my view, the primary risk with addressing light exposure is that of inadvertently creating a nest box for the bird. For example, when initially instructed to reduce our bird’s photoperiod, we did so by keeping her cage covered for 14-plus hours per day. The problem with this was that her cage remained in its original location, a fairly sunny corner of the primary living space in our home. Life continued much the same around her, the primary difference being that an already broody bird had a darkened space in which to indulge herself. Light reduction, if it is to be effective, should probably involve either a second cage in a truly darkened and quiet environment or movement of the primary cage into such a location. Half-measures involving light reduction probably do little more than create attractive nesting environments.


I can see how it would seem like a nestbox if someone is using a semi-opaque cover in a well-lit room with activity going on. The hen is still getting some light and hears life going on as normal around her, just like she would in a real nestbox. The technique is expected to be more effective if you can really make it seem like night. There are limits of course - my flock can hear the wild birds calling at dawn so they know what time it really is. But other than that I can do a pretty good job of simulating night and it works. Nobody lays eggs as long as I'm diligent about maintaining the long nights. If I get sloppy they have an egg-laying party.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

I spoke with a bird vet today. She was really nice to me and talked to me for a long time.  She told me that I should give Chester only 10 hours of light a day. And reduce that to 8 if that doesn't work. She also recommended that I cut out all fat (no more junk food) and to watch how much protein he gets because that can harm his kidneys. The hormone is a chip that they implant using lidocaine. They wouldn't have to put him to sleep. The chip only lasts one season and would have to be replaced if it starts again. An appt. with them and the chip would cost $179. 
The thing that helped me the most-and I don't mean any offense to anyone-is she told me that I have to do what was best for my bird. I've been feeling so guilty that nothing has helped even though I've been trying all your suggestions. Even better is when Chester came out of his cage today, he dropped an almost normal poop! Still at 14 eggs, but tomorrow will tell the tale (day 2 since last egg). Fingers crossed!


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

No offense taken here, the goal here is to stop him from laying any more eggs. It takes about two weeks for the long nights treatment (which is what the vet was suggesting as well, 10 hours of like a day equals 14hrs of darkness) to actually kick in and take effect. I would say if after about two to three weeks Chester is still laying I would definitely try to chip.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Still at 14 eggs


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

So its working??? YAY!


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*they do not lay during the winter (shorter days). *
------------------------------

Not true....we have had several posters with clutches this winter. And I have found that cockatiels will breed any time of the year. There is *no* breeding season for captive cockatiels.

*There's an article that Susanne cites sometimes at*

That is Susan's article and I am the one, while she was on several other forums, advised her to get a fertile egg and have Louise hatch and raise it. Susan also learned that much of the information in regards to reducing daylight hours was information taken out of context from Avian Medicine. The wording was could and should work, not would and does work. But many people jumped on this as the way to reduce hormones, and many have found that it is not a foolproof technique.

In regards to my own birds, after learning many of these recommended techniques are fruitless with some hens, I learned to move them to a totally different cage and have the light on 24/7 and it ended the laying process. The hen might lay one final egg within a day of the change, but this would be a result of one that was already forming in the oviduct.


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## mishkaroni (Jan 6, 2012)

Glad what you're doing seems to be working. I know how frustrating it can be to try everyone's advice and still not have it work. The point is you tried it, though, so I doubt any one here would take offense to it.

As srtiels stated, winter is no guarantee that birds will not lay. They tend to lay in spring, but let's be honest they can breed and lay anytime. I'm one of the one's whose birds laid two successful times this last winter. One of my hatchlings is sitting on me, singing away <3

And as for that breeder who looked at you as if you were an idiot, SHE is the idiot. I've had a tiel lay that many eggs before. AND i've had a parakeet lay 14 in her clutch. It happens, and sometimes can't be prevented no matter what we try.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Thank you Mishkaroni  It's still at 14 but I have a question. I walked past the cage today and Chester was sitting but one egg wasn't under him. He was acting like he did when he laid so I made him move. One of the eggs he was sitting on was broken. Lucy had been in the cage when he was out so I'm wondering could Lucy have destroyed the egg? I took the broken one out, and put an older one under him and he seems ok. I was just wondering if this is something else I have to worry about?


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Eggs can break for many reasons, its hard to tell how it happens.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

I think that Chester is finally done with this whole mess. At least for now. He sat on the 7 eggs, and now he is spending more time off them than on. In fact, the last 2 mornings when I uncovered him, he wasn't on the eggs. I'm going to leave them for a few more days, and then take them out. I think that for some reason he laid 2 clutches this time. The only reason I can think of is him laying in Lucy's cage and than me moving them. I think that confused him and made him lay more than he should have. I hope we don't have to go through this again any time soon  Thank you for the help


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## Pumpkin (Apr 26, 2012)

WOW, what an epic journey. I am glad that Chester is over it, hopefully he will forget the whole saga and allow you some worry free days & nights. We just had a pair lay 4 eggs of which all were non starters. Now to keep them from starting again. Thanks for the great info.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Thanks Pumpkin. It's been a real pain in the you know where  Lot's and lot's of luck. I see that you have 10 tiels, but if you don't mind I have one thing to say. Do what is right for your birds, no matter what you read here or on any other site. That's what got me so upset. I couldn't find 2 sites or 2 people the agree on anything, and it made me feel like a terrible bird mom and an over all idiot :0 So do what you think is right and like I said LOTS O'LUCK


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

This no good rotten little @#$%!# just laid another egg. It's been 21 days since the last (14th) egg. No idea what he's doing or why he's doing it.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Hormones...its the season. I know this may sound kind of out there, but I have read (I think srtiels had this experience) that sometimes with a chronic layer if you let them raise a clutch it will stop them from laying because that urge has been satisfied. Don't know how you would go about it but its an idea.


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## meaggiedear (Nov 20, 2011)

That's an idea. Somebody else was asking about borrowing a male to mate and not to keep. But yeah. Don't know how you'd go about that.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

If you know someone who has fertile eggs and is willing to sell or give them to you, you could slip these eggs under your bird. Make sure that the expected hatch date of the foster eggs is not later than the normal hatch date for the eggs your bird laid - you don't want him/her to abandon the fertile eggs before they're ready to hatch.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

He's laid 4 eggs so far. For some reason he kept one egg from the last clutch, so he's sitting on 5 eggs total. My mom and I were talking about buying a male and letting them try for a fertile clutch. If I do that, how do I keep them from doing a fertile clutch every time? I like the idea of slipping a fertile egg under him, but I have no idea where to get one. No idea where to borrow a male either


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

You can't just "borrow" a male, unfortunately. Birds aren't like dogs or horses because they don't normally provide stud service; what they want is a long-term relationship, not a one night stand. If you can find a local breeder who has fertile eggs and is willing to part with them, you can slip them under your bird, if you're sure that the expected hatch date is earlier than the date your bird is expected to give up on the clutch.

If you get a permanent mate for your bird, they will want to keep on making babies because that's what cockatiels do. If you don't want babies you will have to be the hormone police trying to keep their libidos under control, and if eggs get laid anyway you'll have to prevent them from hatching.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

You could also get him a mate and then once they've raised one clutch, keep them separated in the same room. They'll still have each other's company but wont be able to make fertile eggs.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

I have another question. On Wednesday I came home late and let the birds out. Chester was not biting, but runnning his beak up and down the toes on both of his feet. He would hold his wings out away from his body. Almost like he couldn't find a comfortable way to lay them down. He had really watery poops, and there were seeds from a new type of seed tree in it. I checked to see if there were mites in the cage and didn't see any. I took apart the cage and cleaned it with the hottest water I could stand. He is acting better now both with his wings and with his feet. He has big regular poops (like when he sits) He laid a sixth egg on Monday, and has completely ignored them. I checked to see if there was a lump suggesting another egg-nothing. He's eating (seeds and from my plate), drinking, and flying correctly. Anyone have any ideas what's going on? Could this be a reaction to the new seed trees (which they won't get again)? And could he have gone from laying 5 eggs to 7 eggs to 6 eggs?
 Any advice would be appreciated.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Sounds like a digestive issue not anything to do with the new seed treat. Stress can cause an imbalance in the bacteria in the GI tract.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

But what was the stress? This was the first time he ate these seed trees, and the seeds were in the poop. That's why I thought they were the cause. Digestive issues cause the feet thing? Can I assume (yes, I know) that everything is ok, or do I still have to worry? Do I need to worry about the eggs? Do I leave them another 21 days.
Sorry-freaking out again.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

I don't think the seed treats are the cause, I think it was a coincidence that there is seed in his poop at this time. Laying eggs is stressful on the body. I don't know about the leg thing, all I do know is that the seed in the poop might possibly go away if you give Chester probiotics.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

I took away the seed trees, and the seed in the poop went away. There was another egg today. It was laid on the dining room table, probably his.


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## Cryren8972 (Oct 3, 2007)

Sometimes birds will scarf the seed treats whole, without dehulling the seed, which will result in seed being in their poop. =)


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Thanks Cryren. The seeds were hard when they came through. That might be it.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Today he laid a 7th egg. That makes 7 he laid this time with an eighth egg from the previous clutch. He kept one from that clutch when he started this one. Some people say to slip a fake egg under a bird to try to get them to not lay too many eggs. I realized a little while ago that I can't even con a bird!  Anyway-he's finally sitting on them so maybe he's done for now. One can only hope!


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Another egg today. That makes 9. 8 this clutch, one old egg.


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## purcellbirds (Apr 27, 2012)

This is my suggestion although I'm not sure it would work pair her up .. allow a fertile clutch to be laid then after that pull the box my birds seem to stop after a clutch is hatched if I pull the box .... Buying a male may also be less expensive then vet treatment ...just an ideal but if you don't want anymore birds this may not work for you.... good luck


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## Dreamcatchers (Apr 17, 2011)

Mammajo - there are breeders out there who may loan you a male. Several of us in Texas co-op clutches so that we can outcross or bring in a line we want without having to spend a couple hundred dollars on a bird just for the line. The key is finding a breeder who will do it. 

Another thing I have noticed from your posts is the seed trees, if you are talking about those treat sticks that have seeds clumped together with a molassas or honey. I have a couple of birds who will inhale those things stuffing their crops without hulling. Its the sweet flavoring. They will also attack another bird who goes near them. 

What do you feed regularly? Are you feeding fresh foods, breads, pasta, greens? Or do you feed just seed and pellets? Do you feed at the same time every day? Morning, evening or both? You might try in addition to the daylight treatment, changing your feeding routine to see if this has any effect - especially if you are only feeding in the morning. It may fool them into thinking that there is less food available and therefore not the time to be raising babies.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Hi Dreamcatchers. Thanks for responding. I have thought about letting him have a clutch, but I'm not sure if that's a good idea. The only breeder I know around here is that one I was talking about earlier, and I doubt they would cross the street for me. I was considering getting a male but I really don't have any room for another cage. I will google breeders and see if I can find another one though. 
The seed trees I'm talking about is really millet. I have the stuck together ones but I only let them have about half of one once a month. The millet is a Saturday treat and no other time. I change the food every morning and greatly reduced the amount that I give. The food is a mix of seed and some pellets. I also give sliced apple, pear, broccoli, or lettuce & kale in the morning. I also occasionally give them cooked egg with frozen veg that I chop in the food processor. They like that. They really don't eat that much of any good things though, and I worry that they aren't eating enough. Is some better than none? They do love bread, pasta, and sometimes rice and eat off my plate even when I make a plate for them! BTW: 10 eggs 1 old 9 new as of yesterday I think he's going for 14 again and this time I'm leaving all of them in there :O


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Grand total of 11 eggs for Chester. I looked for breeders in the area. I just missed a bird show on May 9. I don't think that the breeders I found will help. When Chester first started to lay I was panicked and called a few of them for advice and none would help.
Now Lucy has had an egg. Stupid question (another) Everyone says to put the grate in the bottom of the cage. Lu's cage has the grate and the egg broke on it. Doesn't this make them want to lay more eggs? When the egg breaks? Will she eventually lay on the grate? And what if she lays outside the cage, should I put the egg on the grate? Can she sit on them on the grate? Another worry


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

They may break on the grate. Sometimes, a hen will drop an egg from up high to abort it (because she knows it wont hatch or knows she doesn't have a proper nest to sit on it in) so just keep an eye on her. It may be the only egg she lays. The grate actually helps to keep them from laying because they shouldn't be able to get to the paper underneath it (which can be seen as nesting material.)


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

Well, Lucy hasn't laid any eggs in her cage. She's laying them in Chesters cage. So far there are 2, and she's trying to sit on them and attacking Chester when he comes in to sit on his own eggs. So I moved her eggs to another corner and blocked off that corner. Any ideas on what to put on the bottom of Chesters cage so neither of them can lay in that cage?


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

A grate...with newspaper underneath. This way they can't get to the newspaper and its not comfortable for them to lay on the grate. They may even drop a couple from a perch once they realize its not good laying conditions.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

That's just it Roxy-I don't have a grate. I bought this cage second hand and the grate they had in there is not appropriate for a tiel. I've looked all over the internet, in stores, in my garage etc.... I can't find any replacement that will fit and that won't cost a mint.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

You could get wire and cut it to the right shape to put down there. To be honest, I really think that's your issue. They can get to the newspaper at the bottom of the cage, and see it as nesting materials. Why was the grate that came with the cage not appropriate?


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

Another possible solution is to not put anything in the bottom of the cage. This means that you'll have to wash the bottom tray to clean it instead of being able to just take out the dirty newspaper. So it's a nuisance, but less of a nuisance than unwanted egg laying.


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## Mommajo (Sep 10, 2011)

The grate that was in there had bars that were about an inch apart. They would have fallen through it. Would it work if I took the eggs out, cleaned the cage and not put paper back down, then replaced the eggs? I hope that made sense. Or-what kind of wire would be safe and work?


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