# Premature tilting of air sac



## DyArianna

Egg 1 was laid on the 9th... so today that makes it 11 days. Mom and dad have been sitting tight since laid. Everything I can find leads to hatching of course.. just not this early. In my past clutches, when the air sac was tilted this much, there was signs of pipping within two or three days. But I also know that none of my clutches have been routine. 

Any ideas as to if this is normal.. or if I could be looking at a premature chick of some sort? If so, more than likely it won't make it.. but I'm just trying to prepare for what the outcome of this egg might be.

I did searches but didn't come up with what I was looking for.


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## srtiels

Have you candled the egg to see if there are viable veins, and movement? While candling, rotate the egg to see if there are any cracks, especially if the air cell is very large. The earliest an air cell will tilt is at 16 days and that is a result of a hot environment, and hatching would be on day 17.

So more info needed from your observations....


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## DyArianna

My apologies for not enough information. Yes, I candled the eggs last night. The egg is very viable, great veins.. and tons of movement in it. They are in a different room than they were with prior clutches. But this room is not even close to being described as hot. It's not freezing either but kept at around 68. Today is day 12 for this egg. There are absolutely no cracks in the egg. It's not that the air sac is huge because it is typical size.. just the tilting this early was my concern. There is also definitely no way I'm off on the date it was laid either. Do you think it is a safe assumption on my part that this egg will end up a DIS because of prematurity?


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## srtiels

Can you draw a pix, scan it and post it, or a good candled pix to show what you mean?

My first though is how is the humidity in the room. If humidity is low you might want to run a humidifier in the room until your eggs are hatched.

Many times cracks can be felt or seen. What I have done is used food color (dilute the color) on a tissue (it is non toxic) and swabbed the area below the lowest point of the tilt to see if there is a crack.

I know sudden enviromental temp changes can affect hatches....but this is more closer to hatching. Fort example, one day warm, then suddenly a cold front coming in. Several of us breeders nationwide observed that when this happened it explained some abnormal hatches. Thus outside environmental factors can disorientate a chick in the egg. I call it wandering chick because pip marks are erratic and the little one may punch out the side of the egg or out the bottom.

It is quite possible weather can be affecting this egg...only guessing.


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## DyArianna

Well we have definitely had a strange winter thus far. Usually by this time there is at least a couple of feet of snow on the ground. Right now, I'd say there might be 3 inches. The ski areas are really hurting. We do have the heat on and have had for the last couple of months.. so I know the temp inside has been regulated. Humidity levels I'm unsure of as I do not have a humidity gauge working. I will not be able to do the pic of the candled egg until tonight. I will have my daughter assist. I will actually try to do a short video of it so that way maybe the movement can be seen too. Thanks Srtiels..


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## srtiels

Ah....(duh, it didn't look at your location, VT) you will defintely need a humidifier running this time of year. It is from Dec-early spring, nationwide that DIS is the highest because of low humidity.

keep an eye on the size of the air cell. If it gets larger the easiest way to increase the humidity in the nestox is to lightly mist just the inside wall of the nestbox once a day til hatch. Avoid any spray on the bedding or eggs.


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## DyArianna

Will do! Thanks.. will still try and get a video of the egg later tonight. Actually I will candle all 4 on video. Perhaps it will be helpful to someone. I'd just take pics.. but this new camera is not cooperating with me in regards to the flash.


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## srtiels

OK....how I did all my candling pix was to turn off the flash on my camera. I went into a dark closet and layed the egg and the small candler or flashlight pressed against the air cell end. I shot the pix's from 18" away. When downloaded I cropped them so that just a little of the surrounding area was around the egg. If you are downloading to Windows photo Gallery you can try to adjust exposure to bring out more detail.

If you do a vid take one in a dark closet and another in a semi-darkened room to see which comes out best.


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## DyArianna

Great info! We'll see what we can come up with tonight.


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## DyArianna

Okay.. I'm about ready to throw this camera against the wall!  I am beginning to understand now why the people sold it. lol There are too many darn settings on this thing and you get so frustrated trying to figure them out. Bottom line is pics were a no go. Below is a drawing sort of in Paint to show how tilted the air sac is at 12 days. 










We managed to take 10 videos in different lighting and they were all a hodge podge and down right crappy. This one is still pretty horrible.. but you can just barely see the baby moving. 










Gibbs and Hetty did not like us planning a photo shoot. There is really good movement in egg 1 and egg 2. Egg 2's air sac is tilted about half that pic above. Egg 2 is 10 days. I also tried the food coloring you suggested on the egg after the pic.. and there are no visible cracks anywhere. 

There was someone on here at one point I think, who puts little baby food jars of water in their nest boxes with tiny holes punched into the lids. Do you think this is something I should try?? I have atleast started lightly spraying one wall inside the nest box anyway.


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## srtiels

Yes....the baby food jars in the corner of the box would be good, providing they don't spook the parents.

The tilt sure looks like an egg that in in preparation of the chick turning to get in the pip position.

As to camera I have found that a simple cheap Kodak Easy Share camera works as good, without the hassle of all the settings to take my pix's.


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## DyArianna

Great! Thank you! I will put the little jar in the corner and see how they react. If it's too stressful, I'll just stick with misting the side of the box. I guess I'll just sit tight for right now and keep a close eye on them. Will update when I see signs of pipping and we'll go from there. I have never had a clutch that pips and breaks out like Ninja chicks. Mine are usually pipping for a good 2 or 3 days before breaking out. I have had some start to pip and then stop. Could still hear chirping. One didn't make it... I did two assist hatches and of those two only one survived. Both times the yolk sac wasn't completely absorbed. The one who survived it was absorbed a bit more than the other but I still left her in a half shell in the nest for a bit and then mom and dad took care of the rest. This was my Pearl Nel.


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## srtiels

Keep us posted  You might have an early bird. What does the egg weigh?


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## DyArianna

Didn't get a chance to weigh the eggs today. Will try to tomorrow. Also tried a baby jar in the corner of the nest box furthest away from the eggs and Gibbs would not stop alarm calling. I removed it. I will stick with misting one side for now.


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## leeisme

Dyarianna I am the one who has put the baby food jars in the nest boxes becuase of the high mortality rate with low humidity in the nest boxes especially with the dry air during the winter due to heating the house. It seems to have really helped with the hatch rate adding that extra moisture.


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## DyArianna

Ahhhh... well I tried it and it was as if there was an alien in the box. Well I guess there was if you think about it. lol I believe what I might try next time, is right when I give them the nest box, already have the small jar in it. Little ones are due to start hatching this coming weekend or so, so this time round is proving to be too stressful for them.


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## srtiels

*so this time round is proving to be too stressful for them.*
-----------------------------------------------

Just to be on the safe side you might want to give the parents some probiotics prior to hatch. Simple stress can generate some low grade yeast flare-ups, which you don't want to happen close to hatch because the parents will start to eat once they know the chick is ready to pip, and will hold a little reserve in the form of a fluid in their crop to feed the baby until it's yolk sac is fully absorbed inside their bodies.


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## DyArianna

I may have mistyped that. I meant that adding the jar of water this time round was going to stress them out, so I didn't. They don't seem to be stressed in any other way... but the probiotics sounds like a good idea to be safe.


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## DyArianna

I weighed the eggs tonight. Still no signs of pipping.. movement was detected tonight but still good veins. Egg 1 weighs 6 grams. Egg 2 weighs 5 and so does egg 3. I left egg 4 because Gibbs wasn't in the mood to be disturbed so I left the last one in. I also have slight tilting on the 3rd egg now. 

Someone else has eggs laid on the same dates as mine, roughly. Sitting on our eggs began from the get go. But I've always considered my eggs as 1 day after 24 hours of sitting. They were laid the 9th, 11, 13 and 15th. I'm calling them 14, 12, 10 and 8. Is this correct? Or should I be referring to them as 15, 13, 11 and 9?


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## srtiels

Just a random thought....what are you using for bedding?

I start counting day on right after the egg is laid. My guestimate hatch date is calculated for 18 days later. This give me a date to start watching eggs 2 days befor and after the target date.


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## DyArianna

So they should be considered 16, 14, 12 and 10 then. Well then, we really aren't that far off.. and probably not really considered premature tilting of air sac. 

For bedding I actually use rolled oats. I have always used this and it was a suggestion made to me by a woman locally who bred birds for 30 years. It scoops out much like litter for easy spot cleaning and is also something that if ingested will not harm them.


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## srtiels

OK....the rolled oats might contribute to drier hatches because they can act like a wick and draw moisture.


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## DyArianna

Well how did she have such luck with them? Was she adding on the other end of hydrating as she went? Hmmm.... well I can't very well make a change in bedding now. I will just make sure the misting gets done I guess. Any other advice?


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## DyArianna

Well we have one pip mark in egg 1 this morning! Will keep you updated. Hopefully things go well.


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## lperry82

Aw i cant wait for the pics


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## Harleysgirl

yay how exciting 
Good luck little bub!


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## RexiesMuM

Good luck hun !


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## DyArianna

Well as of this evening.. the pip marks have progressed, not quite half around the egg. Still don't hear any chirping and can't yet feel any seizing like I have in the past. Hopefully tomorrow! Keeping fingers crossed.


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## srtiels

You might consider candling to make sure there is movement. What I also do is tap the side of the egg gently to wake up the chick....especially if it has a weak chirp.


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## DyArianna

I candled the egg and couldn't quite tell if there was movement or my eyes were playing tricks on me. Tapped it a good few times and definitely saw movement. Will check in the AM for movement again and any progress.


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## srtiels

Sometimes you can have an exhausted weak chick from trying to pip out....so I learned to keeping listening for sounds, and if not tap the egg to wake the chick up because they can be weaken enough to go to sleep and not wake up again.


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## DyArianna

Do you suggest I check before the AM? Last time I checked was around 7 pm. It's almost 10 now..


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## srtiels

If they will let you check tonight I would since the shell is past the first pipmarks. Mark the end of the last pip to see if there was more piping by morning. If not it could be an indication of a problem. But hopefully by the AM there'll be a little fuzzy in the box.


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## DyArianna

Okay.. did one more check. A couple of the pip marks that were already there seem more raised. Still no chirping or seizing.. but still movement. Tapped a few times to get the movement, little guy must have been resting. Gibbs and Hetty weren't too bothered by me checking. We'll see how the night goes.


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## Harleysgirl

Fingers crossed for a safe hatching!


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## DyArianna

More progress this morning as of 6 AM. More pipping and more pronounced... also chirping. Little guy is working on his hatch day. Will keep a close eye as it might be a tricky day. My previous clutches all seemed to hatch in the afternoon.. but the eggs were also laid in the afternoon. These were all morning eggs.. and this one was laid around 10:30. Will be curious to see how close he/she is.


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## RexiesMuM

Good luck , sounds like the little one is progressing nicely


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## DyArianna

What about you Rexie'sMum? Any pipping in the other eggs yet?? I know this little guy is definitely not a Ninja chick.. but as long as there is measurable progress.. I'm going to let him/her go. Last check was more chirping, can feel the seizing now and can also hear pipping/chipping at the egg. It's kind of cool that today there is a great big ray of sun shining on the side of the nest box. We haven't had good sun like this in the morning for a few days now.


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## RexiesMuM

Egg 2 started pipping this morning


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## srtiels

It sounds like there will be a couple new fluffballs soon


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## DyArianna

THAT is awesome!  Just saw that your thread had been updated.. I have yet to have a complete clutch hatch.. so I'm hoping for that. I wonder if Gibbs has any more hidden splits! If a Lutino pops up.. well then.. he's a mutt alright. lol That'll make him split to pied, pearl, cinnamon, white face and lutino if that's the case. Maybe I'll get a white face this clutch. Mom looks split to that too.. so that would be great!


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## RexiesMuM

Im hoping for a whiteface pearl pied =D That's my fav mutation. This is my first clutch and i really hope the rest hatch my 11 year old bummed out when i told her the first one did not make it


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## DyArianna

Quick update.. visible pip marks have stopped. Still mad movement, seizing and chirping. I really hate attempting to assist as I always feel I'm jumping the gun. This little guy is way up in the air sac. I opened the very tip to get a look inside and the membrane is still looking perfect and there are tiny red spider veins still visible. He doesn't appear to be stuck to the side or anything so I put the egg back in the box and will check again shortly here to see if I need to go further. Will post later.


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## DyArianna

Wow.. what an afternoon! Well little Callen is here! Or Baby G as we are calling him.. after G Callen on NCIS Los Angeles.  He is touch and go though, we'll see how the night goes. I opted for the assisted hatch and took my time with it making sure everything was going good. I would moisten the membrane, remove a little shell, make sure that he was still moving, breathing and chirping and then put him back in with mom and dad. They would immediately get on him and keep him warm. I did this every 20 to 30 minutes. So finally around 5:30 he was completely out. A half an hour ago I got a few drops of Pedialyte into him as he is just a sleepy little guy. He's a good pink, breathing good and mom and dad are still keeping him warm. His abdomen looked good, not black and he still had a little bit of his yolk sac, but not much. It has already almost shriveled up. I'd like to see him a little more active. It will be a long night I think. So let's keep our fingers crossed for him. 

Question... how often should I give him a few drops of Pedialyte?


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## srtiels

Congratulations on the little one  LOL....details please....what color down and eyes?

The parents should be occasionally giving him fluids...just check his crop every little bit, because they digest so quick.


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## DyArianna

Okay.. so I'll just monitor and make sure he's warm, breathing and moving. I just peaked in again and no sign of him, so he's safely tucked under mom and dad I think .. will investigate further in a bit. 

He's got yellow down.. so no white face. And his eyes are dark... so a grey it's looking like..which also means baby boy!  I haven't weighed him yet. Wanted him to get on an even keel first. I've never weighed my chicks right after they've hatched.. it's always been a few days down the road. What should be a good weight for a fresh hatchling?


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## srtiels

Something for the future. Weigh the egg prior to hatch. The shell is only a fraction of the weight, the pre-hatch weight, thus the egg weight will also be the hatch weight. average hatch weighs are 5-6 grams.


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## DyArianna

A couple of days ago the egg was 6 grams. I just went to go check on him again and got mom and dad to move willingly. Little one didn't make it. Dad was still nesting on him though. I checked him over real close and there are a couple little teeny weeny sores on him. I think mom and dad tried to motivate him but he was just too weak. So, in the same boat as RexiesMum.. I kind of had an idea when the pipping stopped that it was going to be a tough one. We'll keep our fingers crossed on the rest of them.


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## srtiels

((((hugs)))


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## bjknight93

Awww...i'm sorry


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## RexiesMuM

Im sorry hun hugs. No progress on my little one either but the sack has titlted alot more and my pip mark is just a little bigger. There is still movement inside so i won't intervene yet as i haven't heard chirping yet either


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## roxy culver

I'm so sorry...the 1st 24hrs are always the scariest in my opinion. When the baby makes it through the first night, that's when I stop worrying. Fingers crossed for the next one!


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## DyArianna

Thanks guys! No signs of pipping yet this morning on #2.. so will update as this one progresses too.


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## lperry82

Aw no i am so sorry for your loss


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## DyArianna

After yesterday being a stressful afternoon.. I had something really cute happen this morning. I know it's a bit off topic for this thread.. but didn't want to start a whole new thread for it. I was walking by Mr McGee's cage and I just about dropped when he came running to the side of the cage and says Peekaboo! His first words!! I'm such a proud momma! Made me feel so much better!  Egg 2 is still not pipping.. still good veins and movement, just not time yet.


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## lperry82

Aw well that is good to hear at least  guess he knew to cheer you up


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## sunnysmom

I'm so sorry to hear about your little one. How nice though that McGee knew to cheer you up! (And I do think they somehow know when you need it. )


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## Sunshine2009

Aww that is so sweet, they do know when you need cheering up, both of mine come to sit on my shoulder when I'm down. I hope the others will have a safe appearance soon!


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## DyArianna

Well as of 4ish this afternoon... no progress on egg #2. You can actually feel the little bugger moving inside the egg though. Will candle again later tonight. And just for kicks, I picked up egg #3 and there are 2 small pip marks on it. He/she must be trying to upstage #2. #2 will be 18 days tomorrow, so as long as I see veins and feel movement I will give it another day or two I think.


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## DyArianna

Still no pip marks on egg #2.. at 18 days. Still feel movement and it looks good though. However, egg #3 has 3 pip marks on it.. all straight in a line with soft cracks connecting them. The interesting thing is that these pip marks are really located half way down the egg, where as my others always pipped about 3/4ths up the egg. Hmmm... Egg #3 is 16 days. Is it possible somehow that egg #2 was delayed in incubation?? From everything I could tell they were all nested upon from the get go. If there are no pip marks tomorrow at 19 days.. should I try and do an assisted hatch? I hear no chirping yet and it's not the seizing movement that I feel when I hold it.. it's just general movement.


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## DyArianna

Update this morning.. egg #3 is chirping quite loudly. You can hear chipping mixed in with the chirping. Still no visible marks on egg #2 and no sound of chirping. I think I'm gong to poke a hole in the end of the air sac and see what I can see. It really should have had some progress by now based on the other eggs. 

On a side note.. had a very strange dream last night. My daughter and I were at the post office and we were holding a can of mixed vegetables. A great big dent was in the side of the can and all of a sudden a hole appeared. When I moved the can to get a good look inside, a baby cockatiel fell out. A few minutes later we were standing in line to get waited on and I was holding the baby who was wearing a tiny sweatshirt.


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## DyArianna

I opened up egg #2 and it was DIS. Had not even broken through the membrane or absorbed any of the fluid within the egg. Yolk sac was still pretty large too. Srtiels, I took pics of it if you would like to investigate.


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## RexiesMuM

DyArianna said:


> Update this morning.. egg #3 is chirping quite loudly. You can hear chipping mixed in with the chirping. Still no visible marks on egg #2 and no sound of chirping. I think I'm gong to poke a hole in the end of the air sac and see what I can see. It really should have had some progress by now based on the other eggs.
> 
> On a side note.. had a very strange dream last night. My daughter and I were at the post office and we were holding a can of mixed vegetables. A great big dent was in the side of the can and all of a sudden a hole appeared. When I moved the can to get a good look inside, a baby cockatiel fell out. A few minutes later we were standing in line to get waited on and I was holding the baby who was wearing a tiny sweatshirt.


OH MY !! What a dream , That woulda be kinda freaky lol Sounds like egg 3 is coming along nicely


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## lperry82

Aw sorry about #2 and what a dream lol


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## Harleysgirl

Aww sorry about baby #2 
fingers crossed for a healthy #3, sounds like he/she is strong


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## DyArianna

Happy Hatchday little one! Number 3 is here!  Yellow fuzz baby. Just hatched about a half an hour ago or so.. so it's still early yet. Mom and dad are in cleaning him/her up. I was too busy checking to make sure everything looked good on him/her.. didn't think to check the eyes out! lol Nice strong little bugger.. so different from the first one that was weak. I'll try to post pics this evening after he/she has had some quality time with mom and dad. Egg 4 has 2 or 3 pip marks on it, so it won't be too far behind.


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## bjknight93

Congrats! Happy hatchday!


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## jellybean

Congratulations! Oh cant wait to see a photo, they grow so fast !!


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## lperry82

Aww congrats i cant wait for the pics either


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## sunnysmom

Great news. Happy hatch day!


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## RexiesMuM

Yay congrats baby !


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## DyArianna

Okay.. so here is baby! Starting out life at a tiny little 5 grams. Doing awesome! Mom and dad have already fed him/her. I'm sorry the pic isn't that great.. will try to get a video soon here. The eyes are not all solid dark.. what do you all think? Cinnamon? Egg #4 is pipping away but no chirping yet. 










I was all set to name the other one a boy's name because I was sure it was a grey, but then it dawned on me.. still could have been a grey pearl which would have been a girl.


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## Harleysgirl

awww congratulations! the little one is beautiful!

question........... what day of incubation did your little ones start pipping?

Egg 3 (first 2 were dis) is on day 17, no sign of pipping but as of yesterday the air sack has tilted and is larger........


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## DyArianna

The first chick pipped for about a day and a half and then all progress stopped. Number 2 didn't pip at all so when I saw a lot of activity in #3 I checked on it and it was DIS. Number 3 started pipping two days ago.. and I let this one go but only because I kept checking and could still hear chirping and feel strong movement. 

Have you candled your egg lately? What do you see inside? Does it still have strong veins and try tapping on the egg lightly to see if you can get the baby to move.


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## Harleysgirl

Candeled last night, good movement in both egg #3 and #4. they move around when i handle the eggs. 
veins are strong and good, strong movement and a larger air sack. egg #3 is on day 17 of incubation......... hoping for something in 2 days or so?


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## RexiesMuM

Awww what a cutie !!! I think the eyes are plum=D so cinnamon it is


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## DyArianna

Harleysgirl said:


> Candeled last night, good movement in both egg #3 and #4. they move around when i handle the eggs.
> veins are strong and good, strong movement and a larger air sack. egg #3 is on day 17 of incubation......... hoping for something in 2 days or so?


See this is where it gets tricky for me. My pipped for two days. Some pip for a lot less than that.. some even I call Ninja chicks and there will be no pip marks and then an hour later there's a chick.  I have yet to have one of these.. only heard others talk about it. 

The other thing to consider is possibly being off on your days give or take a day. Do you know for sure that mom and dad sat tight from the get go? Mine did and I know this for a fact. So I am sure of incubation time. It might be beneficial to you to look at the helpful information in the Stickies under the Breeding section. There are lots of reasons a chick won't hatch and sometimes it can be hard to figure that out. For a chick who is not pipping, but yet you can feel movement and hear chirping, and it is getting on in time.. the chick could possible be mal-positioned. I had one of these. You would then be required to do an assist hatch. If you have never done one.. and even if you have.. it can be scary and stressful. I would also suggest after you check the Stickies for info, you start a new thread for your questions on your eggs hatching. This way you will get more viewers and perhaps more help.


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## DyArianna

Hmmm... one vote for Cinnamon!  If it's Cinnamon.. it's a girl. It will be Jenny. I wish Pearls had a set eye pattern/color. With Cinnamon or Lutino (which would be surprise), it's the only sure way I know it's a girl right now. With Grey.. have to wait to see if there are Pearls or not for boy or girl.


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## Harleysgirl

Thank you, yes I know they incubated due to having another 2 eggs they were already incubating 2 days prior egg #3 being laid. She laid during the night, biggest egg butt when i last checked them at 10pm, egg was there 6am the next day. 

No chirping yet, lots of movement though. 
I THINK mum and dad have pushed it apart from the other 2 but still sitting on him. Might be a getting closer sign. 
Just very nervous after hearing all the loses of late!


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## lperry82

Aww so adorable and so cute  I say cinnamon aswell


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## DyArianna

Little one had a great night! Just a little fluff ball. And so bright yellow. Checked him all over from beak to butt and looks just fine. I weighed him yesterday later in the day, so made the switch to morning this morning and he weighs 7 grams, so doing well! 

Hmm.. I've been referring to baby as him in this post.. but everyone suggests cinnamon and I shined a light on baby's eyes and there is a plum tinge to the center of it. I think I better get used to calling baby her.


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## lperry82

Aw bless have you got any names for her


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## DyArianna

Well, sticking with our line of names so far.. NCIS related (at my daughter's request lol).. I think this one will be baby Jenny. 

I have a question for everyone.. I know when a bird is older that feet and toe nails are a good indication of mutation... but does anyone know how early this happens? I seem to recall with my others that, for example, my grey's feet darkened up at about 2 weeks old... am I right on this?


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## lperry82

Aw Jenny sounds nice name... hmm i don't know about the feet question lol


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## DyArianna

Well we have mad chirping now.. and seizing/chipping in egg 4 (17 days of incubation today). When candled you can see baby in the air sac and a few almost complete holes in the egg. Pre-hatch weight on this one is 5 grams. Will keep a close eye the rest of the day.


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## RexiesMuM

GL hun sounds like the little one will be here today


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## srtiels

*And so bright yellow*

The color of the down, especially is a bright yellow is a good indicator that the baby will have alot of lipochrome suffusing it's plumage....meaning that the facial feathers around the beak may be yellow, and a yellow diamond shape on the forehead, and depending on the mutation a yellow suffusion on the chest.

You can look at the pix's in this link to see when pigment comes in on the feet and nails: http://justcockatiels.weebly.com/watch-me-grow.html


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## DyArianna

Wow.. you can see changes around day 6 or 7 in the feet! Thanks! Bookmarked it. I really can't wait to see how this little one feathers out then! Plus.. can't wait for sibling to hatch so I have a general comparison side by side in hand.


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## sunnysmom

Glad to hear your little one is doing well and that another will soon be here.


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## DyArianna

Well little one decided to be a problem chick. Egg #4 that is.. this afternoon pipping decided to change direction. Instead of continuing horizontally.. baby started pipping vertically. And then no more visible progress. So I did a partial assist. I opened up the top of the egg and moistened to see that baby's wing was in position but baby's head was tucked in way too far and it looked as if the lower wing had moved in front of the beak. I broke away part of the shell to open him/her up more. I could see the yolk sac still needed to be absorbed more, so right now baby is resting in the rest of the shell working on absorbing. Just checked on baby and he/she is still breathing and wings move every so often. I think he/she might be resting but I'll keep checking and see how much of the yolk gets absorbed. The other odd thing about this one is the fuzz/hair. It seems to be bald to almost halfway down its back and then some long fuzz strands. Odd little sweetie. Yellow fuzz. We'll see how things go. I'd like to say I have every faith this one will make it.. but this has been a problem clutch so we'll wait and see. 

On a happy note.. baby Jenny is just full of spunk and pooping up a storm, being fed well.


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## jellybean

Oh no !! Hope little one makes it.
Ill be thinking of you and keep us posted.


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## srtiels

*The other odd thing about this one is the fuzz/hair. It seems to be bald to almost halfway down its back and then some long fuzz strands.*
-----------------------------------------

it sounds like it is premature in development. How well were the parents sitting? It is the down that rapidly grows out when the chick turns in the shell. Have you been having any erratic weather? I* have found that this can also affect hatches, especially if you erratic piping. which reminds me to get my butt in gear and finish all the egg-related collages done....such as this one showing normal and abnormal hatches and the shells are a clue of what to look for. Note I still have to add type to the pix....


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## DyArianna

I would agree on the premature.. but this would be the second full day of pipping on this one and one full day of mad chirping and seizing. Erratic weather.. yes. At least for us. Strange weather really.. temps have been fluctuating from single digits or teens at night to anywhere from between 20s to high 30s even low 40s during the day. We've only got about 4 inches of snow on the ground where we are but we normally have feet of it. But the interior temp has remained at the same degree constantly. However, this would change how often the heat is pumping on its own.


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## srtiels

It does not matter if the inside temps are constant....it is atmospheric changes and fluctuations that can affect the hatch. I don't know if cockatiels have magnetic fields (lack of the correct term) but if so that might explain why the chicks have erratic pips and might trigger early piping and hatching....?????....just thinking aloud.


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## DyArianna

Well little guy is still moving and breathing. Reminds me of someone in a half body cast. How long do you think it will take for the yolk sac to absorb with air getting at it? It was really good sized.. about the size of a nickel.


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## srtiels

*yolk sac to absorb with air getting at it?*

I'm glad you asked. The tissue must be kept moist (blot with a saline solution) If the surface dries it makes it makes it harder to be drawn into the body. *Last resort* you may have to tie off the yolk sac.

In addition there is risk of the exposed tissue absorbing bacteria. What helps is to cut an onion in half and place it near the baby. Onion will absorb any bacteria in the air.


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## DyArianna

Well here is an update! Just checked on little one after freaking about tying off the yolk sac. lol Yolk sac has shrunk from the previous size to about the size of a pea. However, egg shell had dried to her and so had to loosen her up a bit. I still have her but in the shell, but will check again shortly and make sure things are going well. She is still chirping and starting to squirm more. I'm starting to have more hope for this little one! Also, BIG difference in eyes from this one to the other. Am now thinking this one is cinnamon as there is a definite plum center without even using the flashlight. Other one might be split.. but right now.. we'll see. May have to change names! lol


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## srtiels

*Good luck,* and update your tags  Once the yolk is in more you can refer to the assit hatch article and help her get the last of the yolk into the body.


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## RexiesMuM

GL hun sounds like she is really working hard to get that yolk in


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## DyArianna

Nope.. lost her.  She only had a dab of yolk left but I think she just wasn't ready. What a tough clutch. After she had dried off more, there were wisps of yellow on the back of her neck, but still very few. But I am fortunate in that I have the one. 

I'm not so convinced now that my surviving one is a cinnamon after seeing #4's eyes. So we are holding off on naming little one till we figure out what he/she is. I will update tomorrow with pics of little one and weight and then take it from there.


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## srtiels

(((((hugs)))))


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## RexiesMuM

So sorry hun


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## DyArianna

Thanks guys. I must admit though.. it is a little frustrating to see how some people who basically know nothing and do nothing.. have clutches hatch. Do you ever think you are trying to over-analyze and jump the gun on your thinking?


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## jellybean

Im so sorry 
We just dont know why these things happen.


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## lperry82

Oh no i am so sorry  

With everyone loosing theirs im totally not looking forward of mine hatching


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## RexiesMuM

I know exactly what you mean DyArianna . That's why i chose to do some things different with this next clutch , I almost wonder if some of it was my fault being an over protective bird mom.


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## DyArianna

Sometimes I think the simple fact that I have learned soooo much just gets be jumping and more anxious than if I were totally oblivious. lol Don't get me wrong.. I would not give up the information I have learned for NOTHING. Just wish it wouldn't start making you think of ALL these things that could go wrong. 

On a happy note.. little one had a great night! Weighed this morning at 9 grams. So a tiny increase for a tiny one.. we'll take any increase!  He/she is really mobile and is being fed great.. good coloring and everything. I inspected the eyes again better this morning and I'm leaning now back towards a grey or a pearl again. Definite difference between this one's eyes and #4.


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## DyArianna

srtiels said:


> *And so bright yellow*
> 
> The color of the down, especially is a bright yellow is a good indicator that the baby will have alot of lipochrome suffusing it's plumage....meaning that the facial feathers around the beak may be yellow, and a yellow diamond shape on the forehead, and depending on the mutation a yellow suffusion on the chest.
> 
> You can look at the pix's in this link to see when pigment comes in on the feet and nails: http://justcockatiels.weebly.com/watch-me-grow.html


This is very interesting to me as Mom has these yellow markings on her forehead and by her beak. She's also one with the spot gene all over her chest area. McGee also has these markings and has the spot gene too. Dad has no spots.. and Nel (Pearl) can't really tell.


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## tielfan

> This is very interesting to me as Mom has these yellow markings on her forehead and by her beak. She's also one with the spot gene all over her chest area. McGee also has these markings and has the spot gene too.


Maybe a little "blaze" on the forehead is a spot gene characteristic. Shodu has it and so do all her babies (the non-lutino ones anyway).


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## leeisme

Sorry to hear of your losses in this clutch. Winter is a depressing time to breed tiels.


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## Harleysgirl

oh im sorry for your lose  

sorry i missed this post.

Very glad to hear the little one is doing well


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## DyArianna

Well this morning is my first (as close as I can get for now) true weight of baby without much in his/her crop. Little one is weighing in at roughly 10 and a half grams. Very little increase from yesterday, but crop was good and full at weight. So, hopefully tomorrow morning I catch baby at an almost empty crop as well. Weight gain is slow. Active as all get out and looking nice and healthy though.


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## srtiels

*So, hopefully tomorrow morning I catch baby at an almost empty crop as well. Weight gain is slow.*
------------------------------------------

When little it is hard to find them with an empty crop for weighing. Just pick the same time every day to do the weigh in. If you look at the Watch Me Grow page the baby had some crop contents in each photo. I tried to make sure that the crop had the proportionate size for the photo shoot.


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## DyArianna

I actually weighed him last evening too.. just to make sure there was an increase and not a stand still or decrease. I think I will do the same for a few days. Just only record weight in morning.


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## srtiels

Here are a few helpful things. Just double click on them for the largest view. Right click, copy and save to Windows Photo Gallery or a photo-editing program. They are in *jpeg* format. Once saved you can print them out. If they are printed out on 3 hole paper or punched they can be kept in a binder. These were something I wanted to add to the Breeder Record keeping article. (which I have to get back to and complete)


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## DyArianna

Well after hearing baby feed just about every hour this morning.. thought I would take him/her out for some play time with the boys. Also, thought I could notice a sizeable difference in the baby just since 7 this morning.. so I weighed baby again for fun and baby weighed 13 grams. I know it fluctuates during the day, so will be curious to see in the AM what baby weighs. Anyway, here's a video of baby enjoying the 3rd day of life.


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## lperry82

Aw bless look at it go  peachy stopped what she was doing lol


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## sunnysmom

Aw, so sweet.


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## meaggiedear

Lol. I loovveeee the video.


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## DyArianna

Okay guys, I'm flopping back and forth here. Now thinking Cinnamon again. lol Arrgghhh.. The eyes have a grey ring on the outside.. then a lighter ring and then there is definitely plum in the center where the pupil would be. Still early for the feet and toe nails but they are still pink as a baby's bottom. 

The plan this time round is to keep my fingers crossed and hope Gibbs and Hetty don't double clutch. I really want to NOT pull this baby and let mom and dad raise it to fledging. Will still do daily handling and will pull if necessary, but want to give this route a shot.


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## DyArianna

This morning baby weighs a good solid 13 grams with nothing in her crop!  She was holding up her head like she was checking everything out .. (eyes are still closed of course). Again, an increase and baby is looking really good.. so we'll take it. You can hear mom and dad feed every hour to hour and a half so we're ...content right now.


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## lperry82

Aww thats good to hear


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## srtiels

*The eyes have a grey ring on the outside.. then a lighter ring and then there is definitely plum in the center where the pupil would be.*
-----------------------------------

Now it is a wait and see as to the mutation. With cinnamons it takes a couple days for the melanin (dark pigment) to be pronounced in the eye. As it gets distributed it also masks the red that is shown which is actually a reflection from the blood vessels in the eye (simple explanation) The hardest area for the melanin to mask is the pupil which with females will have deeper distribution and the males will have less allowing a deep wine red to reflect back when they are older, and adults.


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## RexiesMuM

Sorry to hear about the last two babies , And glad that the little one is doing so well . Sounds likes they will be such good parent's


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## DyArianna

Baby is still doing well and we still have weight gain. This morning the scale couldn't decide between 17 and 18 grams.. but settled on 17 at 5 days old. Wish he/she was a bit bigger but again, we'll take it! So, he/she is doing good. Baby is looking a little dry on the skin though. I will try to post pics tomorrow. I had stopped spritzing the side of the nest box after the last egg was removed. I think I'm going to continue doing this and see if that helps with the dry skin. Everything else looks perfect though on baby. Feet are still pink but a few toe nails are starting to get a slight tinge to them. I can see the small line of coloring (either gray or cinnamon) starting to come through on the wings.  Still nothing yet where the crest will be. Eyes seem to be evening out more with color.. not so much the defined dark ring, light ring, plum center so who knows! lol


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## srtiels

Increasing the humidity in the nestbox will help with the dry skin, and keep the little one hydrated. Humidity promotes good pinfeather growth as they emerge from the skin. Normally parents will wet the babies in the nest til they are just about feathered.


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## DyArianna

Got it. Thanks! Will also make sure mom and dad are lightly spritzed daily. I have only been doing that a couple times a week as it is winter here. But will up it.

Addition: Next morning.. baby is up to 21 grams. Feet are not pure pink any more, almost look like they are taking on a bit of a tinge of very, very light grey. Can't wait to see what little one looks like!


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## DyArianna

25 grams this morning. Baby is doing well, motivating around, hissing!  We have now officially ruled out cinnamon. However, I think it will be split to cinnamon based on the eye color in the beginning. Baby is 1 week old today and it is now just a waiting game to see if baby is pearl or grey with splits.


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## srtiels

*motivating around, hissing!*
-----------------------------------------

LOL....they look so cute and seriously looking at that age when they hiss and rock. I'm working on a collage showing what to look for as the pinfeathers are emerging if it is a pearl.


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## DyArianna

I'm wondering if it's a Pearl because so far there are no signs of dark pins at the butt.. just some little yellow ones so far. But it's still early.


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## srtiels

Yes... a pearl will have the yellow pinfeathers to the tail, and as pins emerge on the shoulders it will at first glance look like black-heads. A normal pearl will have dark/black toenails and a cinnamon pearl brown. Feet will be pink with a faint grey wash coming in after 10 days of age.


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## DyArianna

Do you have all the pics you need for your collage? Hahahhahah.. of course you do. You're a pictorial encyclopedia.  I was just thinking though.. I might have some pics that are half way decent of when McGee and Nel were babies.


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## DyArianna

Okay well this little one is proving to be interesting. Maybe it's because I only have the one and so baby is under a microscope so to speak. lol Anyway, 28+ grams this morning.. and more coloring coming in. Still just yellow on the butt area... but feet are a bit more shaded than yesterday. More coloring in the wing areas and starting on the shoulders. Eyes are starting to open up today!  This baby's weight matches up with my pearl at her age.. but the development matches up with my grey at this age.


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## lperry82

Hope to see pics


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## Harleysgirl

hows this little one going


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## Sunshine2009

So glad to hear the little one is doing so well! Sounds like will be a beautiful bird!


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## DyArianna

This little one is no longer little!  He's weighing in at 102 grams, 28 days old, little boy, at the very least a grey. His name is Callen or Baby G.


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## Harleysgirl

AWWW what a cutie! hes beautiful x


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## Sunshine2009

He is so beautiful!


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## lperry82

Aw he is adorable


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