# Gibbs and Hetty have been separated...



## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

*Hetty is done if I don't.....*

I had no other choice. I am really upset. I know that I haven't lost a beloved feathered friend and I feel a bit silly right now typing this. I'm just really upset about it. Previously I had posted how Gibbs would go after Hetty.. and then he settled down again. Well tonight he was full bore on going after her. 

He would chase her arounnd the cage and grab ahold of whatever he could get of her.. and if she got a few second's reprieve.. she was breathing hard. But when I heard her start screeching... that was it! I grabbed the spray bottle and tried to stop Gibbs from attacking her. I was really upset. Finally Gibbs gave up.. soaking wet.. and I blocked Gibbs in the nest box and grabbed a small towel. Hetty and Gibbs are still not too hand tamed but I knew she needed out. She didn't even fight me at all.. poor girl. I put her in the cage with her two chicks who are now 10 weeks old. Gibbs is now left with an empty cage with 2 eggs in the nest box. 

There is no blood and Hetty really does seem fine.. physically maybe. She has laid too many clutches this year... and everything I did outside of separating them didn't work. I feel so bad for her. Right now I'm really angry with Gibbs. But I know.. deep down.. he probably wanted her to care for the eggs and she didn't. 

Hetty was sitting there in the new cage.. and she didn't even fret. She was playing with the toys.. and then she walked across the perch .. acted like she wanted to poop and ... the 3rd egg.. which was due today.. fell out. It dented pretty good from the fall to to the bottom of the cage so it's gone. But this clutch is not my priority. Gibbs and Hetty are. I need words of wisdom. Do you think they will ever be alright together? Or should I consider.. later.. not right now of course as healing needs to take place.. getting them new partners?

I honestly can't believe how horribly he was after her tonight. I tried everything outside of shots to stop her from laying again. Wanted to give the poor girl a break. Didn't dare to separate them because they were *bonded*. I honestly think if I had left her in that cage tonight for the night... she would have been dead. 

I really need some advice in this situation... please..


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## morla (Aug 15, 2011)

Aw! I am sorry your angry with Gibbs. 

I hope that it gets better soon!


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

dont worry. i had to separate my two several times too. once for breeding. i attempted to breed and it went bad so to say as i didnt realize my birds ARENT bonded. they were a weird thing... dally sees me as her mate but tsuka sees dally as his mate... they mated, but dally didnt want him in the nest box and would attack him out of it but ask me for scritches while in the box. she laid after i had removed the box, just one egg. tsuka had to be removed as he started attacking her badly and chipped her beak. he screamed nonstop so we rehomed him for a month and took him back when care wasnt being met properly.

it took some time to reintroduce them again, theyre not friends, they dont care much for eachother. they tolerate eachother and bicker from time to time.

you on the other hand, have a hen intent on nesting. i think its a good idea to separate them for awhile. if she continues to lay eggs in the other cage, you can give the eggs to the male in his box and replace her eggs with fake ones so she stops laying. he will raise the clutch and once the eggs hatch, you can give half to him, and half to her. it might help. if not you can assist feed. the males are the maternal ones in the pair usually.


are you sure theyre bonded? how do you think they are?


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Maybe you should give them some time apart...a few weeks or so. And then introduce them to each other as if they had never met. Let them have time outside of the cages with each other (if you can, I know they aren't tame and may be unmanageable), and let them live beside each other in separate cages for a while also. Then you can try placing them in the same cage together...keep the nest box out, rearrange the cage, put it in a different part of the room, place fake eggs in the cage if she does lay...and see how they do with each other. Cockatiels are only supposed to have 2 clutches of babies a year to keep healthy (I feel like you already know this), so you should try to discourage egg-laying. 

If they still do not do well together then it's probably time to purchase a second cage and a couple of new birds to pair them up with (a year or older so they'll be of breeding age).

But i agree, that girl needs a break from her boyfriend and from being a mother. Maybe they'd be easier to tame while they're apart...you should try it.

Good luck!


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Well the night went good. Hetty spent a relaxing night with McGee and Nel. Gibbs was quiet too. I am not so mad at him anymore. I think I'm going to leave things the way they are right now for a bit and then decide what to do. 

As far as what makes me think they were bonded... When I adopted them they were together and the family said they had been together for a long time. That combined with me actually witnessing their affection for each other (preening, hanging out close together, just all around loving on each other) led me to believe they were bonded. I had previously posted a question about them possibly being a bondage pair instead though. 

As I think back on the situation, he gets really agressive towards her when she's laying. Like he wants her to go in the nest box but she won't. So he chases her and just gets mean to her. She seems so much more sweet than him now. I have no doubts that she would be fine with a new cage mate. Him, however, I'm not sure. What if he did this again to another bird?


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## chloe92us (Jul 12, 2011)

You'll find out for sure if they're truly bonded by how they act when they're apart. If they're happier apart, then they were probably a bondage pair.


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## tuni324 (Aug 1, 2010)

I have seen the same thing. As said in past posts, I had to pull my one, only, & first baby at 8 days old. I saw a lot of aggression with the parents at the beginning and then they turned into loving wonderful parents. Well, they obviously weren't happy I pulled their baby because mom just laid her 2nd egg and exactly as you've said, again he has been extremely violent to her during the laying stage. It appears to be that he is possessive of the eggs and doesn't want her near them but it's just till night time. It's really weird. Identical behavior this time around.I thought he was going to kill her yesterday and now they are like best buds. Peaches shoots out of the cage when this starts. I'm beginning to see it as part of the "breeding cycle" unfortunately.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Yeah it sounds like your girl Hetty will be fine with another mate but not one that's over-bearing since she seems very submissive. But Gibbs, if he gets another mate, she'll need to be less submissive..it seems like any bird you might put with him would cause them to butt heads with each other because a submissive one will be chased and a dominant one will fight back. Maybe Gibbs needs to be in a male-male pair (or kept alone) and only be placed with females for breeding. It seems less of a headache that way.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

if he is an aggressive bird, it may not be smart to give him another mate. especially one that will fight back, because thats asking for injury there


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Boy was he mad at me this morning when I checked on him. I have never seen him lunge at me like that before. And holler! Wow.. Hetty heard him and stuck herself on the side of the cage closest to him and just hung there and watched him, giving a small chirp every now and then. She is back to just relaxing in the cage with McGee and Nel and now Gibbs has calmed down too. When I went to change Gibbs' water and food he didn't go after me at all and he chirped at me a couple of times. Such mood swings.


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## Puppydog (Oct 13, 2011)

Wow! What a wealth of interesting new info! Thanks for teaching me something new each day! 

I hope you can get them all to live together with tolerance.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Hormones can cause the mood swings. My males are the passive ones in the relationships here, Fuzzy didn't sit hardly at all last season, Bubbles was a 24/7 sitter. She didn't want anyone to do the work but her. It sounds to me like Gibbs wants a girl like that, someone who will do all the sitting and be in the box all the time. Now, was he like this with ALL the clutches or just this last one? Because it could be that she's just worn out from laying and doesn't want to do it while he still does. I would keep them separated for now, see how they act. It sounds like they're a bonded pair because they do call to each other and she is trying to get near him so I don't think bondage is the issue. I think its just a difference in what they want and they haven't resolved their issues yet. Marriage can be rough sometimes! lol


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

LOL Poor birds... ! They are really tugging at my heart strings tonight. Gibbs will come out of the nest box and look over at her. He'll chirp a few times and she'll chirp back and then move to that side of the cage. He's still sitting away on the 2 eggs. 

With the first couple of clutches I don't remember having these problems. This could be for two reasons though.. 1 being the issue wasn't there.. or 2 I wasn't that educated enough to notice it or used to them enough to understand them and notice it. These last few clutches have gotten progressively worse for sure. Tomorrow she would be due to lay another egg. We'll see if she does. However, she usually has really evident *egg in the pants* the day before she lays. And I don't really see that on her today. I'm definitely going to keep her separated. I put one fake egg (to replace the one she laid from the perch that dented badly yesterday) with her in this cage and she hasn't acknowledged it at all. 

I think I will let Daddy Gibbs raise one and let Hetty raise one if they both hatch and I'm leaving her separate from him until next year. I just hope it gets easier watching them look at each other and talk to each other. I'll put McGee in with Gibbs if I see Gibbs getting lonely. 

Wow.. you know.. before this clutch I knew she needed a break. They just seemed to settle with the longer nights and change of season and this time round I never actually saw them mate as I did before. So I thought they were closing up shop on their own. Laying eggs, hatching them, seeing those gorgeous babies and watching them grow. It is really easy to get caught up in that. Gibbs and Hetty are my main priority and always will be. I really don't think I'm ever going to be able to let these two live together constantly again. I will let them breed again next year and see how it goes. But this clutch after clutch will NOT happen again. 

I am just thankful I still have two healthy birds. Mentality might be a little unstable right now.. but physically.. they are healthy. I can deal with giving them love and the mood swings. It could be so much more worse. 

I would like to thank you all for all the great advice/experience/support. It is truly very helpful.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

He's probably just stressed out...give him some time. Losing your mate and becoming a single egg-sitter in one day can't be easy. He has to manage eating and keeping the eggs warm.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Today we're still holding strong. Today he was a little irritated when I was getting into the cage to change/clean food and water, but I just slowed down and told him what I was doing and he chirped at me. Even though they are in separate cages, they are only a few feet apart. I wonder if this is cruel. Seeing something you want but you can't have. On the other hand though it could be comforting to them to still be able to see each other. Hetty still goes to that side of the cage to talk to him every now and then.. but then she'll go back and settle in her favorite spot. She doesn't seem to be bothered by McGee and Nel at all.. which makes things a lot easier! Still no egg yet today but this clutch has been being laid in the evening. I haven't given her a nest box because I don't want to encourage her to lay anymore. When I changed the liner this morning I added some padding under the paper just in case we have another perch laying. Might be able to stop it from breaking and give it to dad to sit on. She hasn't done a thing with the fake egg. I peaked in on the two eggs in the nest box with dad and they are still quite pink. The first one was laid 6 days ago. So either he hasn't been nesting as tight as I think he has.. or this clutch might not even be fertile.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

just let them sit anyways fertile or not 


as for another egg, when i removed dally's nest box, she laid 2 days later right off a perch and broke the egg. she never laid any more. reason being, no nest box to lay the egg, so she aborted it purposely and never laid anymore.

maybe thats whats going on with yours too?


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Yeah.. I'm going to let him sit no matter what. It will keep him busy for a bit. There are also no signs of *egg* poop from Hetty which I'm just realizing now! Keeping fingers crossed. Everyone's eating, drinking and pooping fine so I think I made a good choice.


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

yeah most likely. might just be having a dispute and need some time alone


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Good luck with them! They sound like they're doing well.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

I have successfully stopped Hetty from laying! She usually lays 4 or 5 but no more eggs this time. I'm really glad. They are still separated and Gibbs seems to be doing much better having some alone time. I candled the two eggs in the nest box and one looks like it could be fertile but doesn't look as advanced as the past clutches at this date, so he's not sitting on them faithfully as I thought he was. Also the one that doesn't appear to be fertile has been shoved to the side and is cold. This is the first time this has happened. They've always sat on them all and all the eggs have been fertile. I'll candle this one again in a few days unless he gets sick of that one too. Just thought I would update.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

You can probably take the cold egg out since he isn't paying attention to it. They usually move unfertileeggs out of the clutch...i don't understand how they know which are and aren't fertile though. It's interesting.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

So we're still plugging along! The two eggs are infertile and now down right cold as he just won't sit on them anymore. Which is fine by me! So today I decided to give him something else to think about and moved all the birds to a different room. More out in the open in the living room. I also removed the nest box and gave Gibbs a cage mate, his boy McGee. So far, so good. Gibbs has yelled at McGee a few times, but he is mostly singing away exploring his new surroundings. I added a new toy and another perch, manzanita. Now Ms Hetty has even more quiet time as she only has Nel in her cage with her. Keeping fingers crossed to see how things go. *I* feel so much better knowing Gibbs isn't alone now and I hope he does too.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

I'm glad things are going well...if you do decide to give Hetty a new mate, i would wait a while so she won't be laying too much. Give her a break from laying and rasing clutches and get her calcium levels up. Good luck! Keep us updated.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

I'm thinking about giving them both new mates. But definitely not till next Spring. Will update in a few days and then if I don't have any issues I need help with.. we can close this thread!


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

> You can probably take the cold egg out since he isn't paying attention to it. They usually move unfertileeggs out of the clutch...i don't understand how they know which are and aren't fertile though. It's interesting.


They can feel the heartbeat through the egg within the first couple days, that's how they know its fertile.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Well tonight I found this interesting. Gibbs and McGee have been cage mates now for 2 days. Recap.. Gibbs will be 3 in February and McGee is his almost 11 week old son. Gibbs has been Mr. Attitude for weeks.. and now McGee.. in two days.. is top dog?? I actually saw McGee screeching at Gibbs trying to tell him to get away from the perch he was on tonight! Is it possible that within 2 days Mcgee has grown up from what I thought was a little boy birdie to a young man birdie? They are fine together all in all though. They eat fine and sometimes I will catch them sitting near each other. I got a little worried at first because I heard Gibbs calling to McGee like he used to Hetty. But McGee has gotten really good at mimicking so he can almost whistle right back at him. I think Gibbs is thoroughly confused! lol


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## thewandererw (Aug 22, 2011)

I adoped two parakeets over the summer and they were in one cage they are male and female. well the female started to lay eggs for the first time,so i seperatered them and the male screamed for the female for three days,but now they have stopped screaming for each other.the female has laied 5 eggs so fare she was to lay today but no egg hope she is done.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

*Gibbs is trying to make life miserable right now..*

Him and Hetty haven't been separated that long and things were working out great! Him and McGee are still getting along.. but Gibbs is constantly calling for her now. 

I literally had a headache today from him calling for her. They are in the same room and within eye shot of each other.. not even 10 feet away from each other. But his constant calling for her.. oh my godz!!!!!!! I literally had to put the cage with Gibbs and McGee back in the other room. It was just so constant, my head couldn't take it anymore. He called for a little while after moving him.. but it was also time for bed.. so he has settled and my head is thankful. lol Hetty is fine and still enjoying her break with Nel. Gibbs is just so adamant about having his Hetty back. But I'm still holding strong. Thank the Godz for Advil.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Would it be good for them to have their cages closer to each other? Maybe if you shortened the distance to maybe 1 foot, Gibbs would be more at ease. And was Hetty calling back?


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

I put them back in the other room and they are closer. About 2 feet apart. She would call back to him but only every now and then .. and then it was if she was saying.. Will ya cut that out already! lol Eh.. it's a new day.. head ache is gone.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

I was just making sure her calling back wasn't as urgent as his. She's probably doing just fine while Gibbs is over there getting stressed out. Poor baby..he'll be alright.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Just a quick update...

We are still holding tough. They will still call to each other and move to that side of the cage closest to each other. But it's definitely not a desperate call. Gibbs has not had any more outragious screeching sessions (my head is thankful) but I am now concerned about Gibbs' thoughts of McGee. I've caught him walking up to McGee several times over the last few days.. doing his little mating call.. acting all suave... and McGee just throws him off with mimicking him back. This is probably a silly question.. but how exactly should I react if I find Gibbs on top of Mcgee? I mean I'm sure it won't hurt him.. but my gosh.. it's his boy for cripes sakes. lol I know I'm humanizing them a bit.. but .. well... I just can't help but think of poor little McGee in that situation. I am glad Hetty is not in there, because he would for sure be after her again. But sacrifice McGee? It hasn't happened yet.. or maybe it has.. who knows! lol argggghhhh! I wish there was a pill something opposite of Viagra for birds.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

It wont hurt McGee, its weird to us but males will mate with each other whether their related or not. Gibbs obviously likes the pleasure aspect but to prevent it I would increase their night hours and rearrange their cage once a week to throw them off.


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