# Suspected Liver Issues



## PC9850 (Feb 22, 2012)

As many of you may remember, Petey was sick with Clamydiosis and had been on antibiotics for about 3 months before the watery droppings subsided. She enjoyed about two weeks of health until the watery droppings suddenly returned with a vengeance, and this time with a new twist: Undigested seed.

I researched the issue and saw that the common solution was to administer a probiotic. Petey was coming off a very long course of antibiotics after all, and I think I also remember a thread where we tried to establish that it could be from egg laying hormones. I tried Acidophilus but did not get any results. Then I remembered when my vet had mentioned the watery droppings could also be due to liver issues, and to try a product called Liver Detox. A quick Googling showed the preferred product is actually called Aloe Detox. Any advice on which one to go with?


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## MeanneyFids (Aug 24, 2010)

psittacosis often affects the liver.
sometimes it takes a few weeks for probiotics to start working, keep watch and good luck!


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

I can't comment on the detox products. But soaked or sprouted seed is easier to digest than dry seed, so if you offer seed in this form and she eats it, she might be able to get more nutrients out of the seed before it leaves the body. There's info on sprouting at http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=9019

I would offer plain soaked/sprouted seed at first to see if she likes it, since many cockatiels don't appreciate wet food. But if she likes it, you can try mixing a little of the detox product with it to see if she'll eat it that way. Wet foods are a good vehicle for liquid supplements as long as the bird isn't turned off by the taste of the supplement.


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## JaimeS (Nov 28, 2011)

I don't know about the other stuff either but my avian vet told me that acidophilus does not work well for birds. I have used benebac successfully. I hope everything goes well with Petey, I always love hearing about her.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

I know allbirdproducts.com has probiotics you could try (I know they have Guardian Angel among other things.) Its worth a shot to try a better probiotic before using something that could affect her liver as that can be tricky.


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

I've had a couple birds with liver problems..and I've seen those detox things. I don't really know how they work but the word 'detox' makes me feel like it would be hard on the birds system. And giving the organ system a hard time is the last think you want to do when a bird is recovering from illness.

I suggest you keep Petey on a good diet and put herbal extracts in her water. I use Milk Thistle Extract at a ration of 1 drop to 3 oz of water daily, Dandelion Extract at the same ratio daily, and then I put about 3-5 drops of Corn Silk Extract once every week or so.


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

Aloe Detox can work -- it worked very well for several birds at my friend's rescue. But, she used it under very careful instruction from the rescue's vet. I don't think I'd recommend just buying it and guessing at the dosage/type.


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## tizercat (Sep 5, 2012)

My senegal has known liver issues (increased values on bloodwork & her liver is about 20% larger than it should be on radiographs) and I use milk thistle as a supplement for her. I would hesitate to recommend anything with Petey's history without the caveat that you should talk to your avian vet. But adding a probiotic like Bene-Bac would be a safe bet - it contains 5 different probiotic organisms and would definitely be helpful after a long course of antibiotics. Good luck!


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## birdsoo (Jul 4, 2012)

I have found an avian vet in my country (finally, yay!) who seems to know what he is doing. He passed all my sneaky test questions with flying colours, so I feel safe giving his opinion on some things here

I asked him about milk thistle as a liver supporting agent and he agreed that it is a supplement that works. He said they also use it with cats. But the dosage for birds can be tricky (probably because we do not have those tinctures in diluted forms here, so they must be quite strong). I am also a member on a holistic treatment forum and I have read a lot of people using milk thistle to help their birds with liver problems, even advanced liver failure and it helped them a lot, especially where the traditional medicine was not helping. 

I also read a lot about Aloe Detox. It was the product they used to help clear the bird's liver from toxic agents to help liver function properly and give it enough time to regenerate. I have not read anything that ended in bad results about it, either, but it is never certain.

Another thing you should consider is that the undigested seeds are not necessarily from a liver disease. It is true that liver can be worn out due to long disease, but the digestive system might not be functioning properly due to some other infections like avian gastric yeast or PDD. Anything that interferes with digestion and stops/lessens it might cause undigested food to pass. So it is good to keep those in mind, especially after a lengthy antibiotic treatment that disturbs the balance of gut flora. You should also get these possibilities checked because if it is nothing else, including liver, it could be PDD and the treatment works best if it is done as early as possible.

I hope you find out what the cause is and show that problem the door


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## PC9850 (Feb 22, 2012)

Okay, it's been a few days of the Aloe Detox and there's been a substantial decrease in the watery droppings. Droppings are also looking more black so this tells me toxins are indeed being flushed out.

However, now she's back to being severely nesty. In her 12-15 year life I have never seen her more hormonal than she is right now. Constantly doing mating dances, getting down in a bottom corner of the cage and sticking her tail up against the bars, and ripping all her straw toys to shreds for nest material. She has yet to lay an egg of any sort and it's driving me nuts. Will have to start looking into hormone reducing methods.


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## tielfan (Aug 31, 2008)

I'm glad she's feeling better, but it's sort of like out of the frying pan and into the fire, isn't it?

We have a sticky on hormone control at http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=32330


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## PC9850 (Feb 22, 2012)

I realize my previous post was a bit unclear - the hormones aren't a result of the aloe detox as it started up around the same time as the watery droppings returned. However, it certainly does seem like one thing after the next with this poor bird. Just hasn't been right since the initial sickness in May.


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## enigma731 (Aug 12, 2011)

Do you think you could post the exact product you ended up getting, and how you're dosing it? That might be helpful to others in the future if they're looking to do a similar type of treatment.  Glad Petey seems to be doing better, even if she's still nesty.


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## birdsoo (Jul 4, 2012)

Could it be possible that now her body is recovering and liver, a very vital organ is getting cleared of toxins so the body is working, the hormones are getting produced, the body thinks it is a good time to go breed yay, lol


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## PC9850 (Feb 22, 2012)

It's called Lily of the Desert Aloe Herbal Detox Formula:










Right now I'm giving it to her in her water in a 50/50 ratio, as this is recommended for "very sick birds" with liver issues. I'll continue this until the droppings stop turning black, then I'll reduce it. 3 weeks is the suggested maximum usage for full recovery. Here is where I got my info after the vet talked about it:

Fatty Liver


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