# Separating...



## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

Hey guys, so I'm new here. 

I registered because I just got 2 cockatiels about 2-3 weeks ago. My moms friend didn't want them anymore because apparently she had too many dogs (or something along those lines). Anyways, my mom decided to take them. We already own 2 budgies, so she figured they wouldn't be too different. We have the cockatiels and budgies in different rooms (for quarantine). 

The two tiels are a male and a female and about a week and a half ago, we saw them start mating...at least several times. The day before yesterday, I decide to take the female out and BAM, an egg falls on the floor while she is on my finger. That same night, we notice the male acting differently...a few hours later we see him panting (like if he's having a hard time breathing). Upon doing some more research, I decide to take him out an put him in another cage in a warmer spot because I don't want the female getting sick. All of yesterday he was apart from her and she kept yelling for him. Today, it's been nonstop that she's kept yelling for him. 

So, my question is, until I get him to a vet, should I keep them separated as I have or not? Since she appears to be ready to lay more eggs, is it okay to keep them separated? Should I worry about her laying without him or will she just not lay them because he is gone? Also, what tips do you guys have to get her to stop yelling for him since he's sick (if they should be kept separated). I know this falls in between the health and breeding categories, so I just put it here.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Hmmm... first question would be .. are you POSITIVE they are male and female? The reason I ask is because sometimes a female will pant and shake when she's trying to pass an egg. Do you have pics of your two birds that you can post please?

As far as separating them.. I think you did good in that at this point, you don't know what is going on. Although, being that they have been housed together previously, obviously for quite a while.. keeping him separated right now would only serve the purpose of keeping him comfortable and warm until you find out his issue. 

There could have been many things to cause him to be panting. A respiratory issue could be one.. having a piece of seed stuck could be another (he wouldn't be panting, more like trying to cough it up), or being injured or hurt somehow. If he is sick or injured.. you are going to need to contact an Avian Vet and get him in to be checked out.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

DyArianna said:


> Hmmm... first question would be .. are you POSITIVE they are male and female? The reason I ask is because sometimes a female will pant and shake when she's trying to pass an egg. Do you have pics of your two birds that you can post please?
> 
> As far as separating them.. I think you did good in that at this point, you don't know what is going on. Although, being that they have been housed together previously, obviously for quite a while.. keeping him separated right now would only serve the purpose of keeping him comfortable and warm until you find out his issue.
> 
> There could have been many things to cause him to be panting. A respiratory issue could be one.. having a piece of seed stuck could be another (he wouldn't be panting, more like trying to cough it up), or being injured or hurt somehow. If he is sick or injured.. you are going to need to contact an Avian Vet and get him in to be checked out.


Yes. I'm positive the one who laid the egg is the female and the one who is panting is the male. The male is the grey-ish one while the female is the yellow-ish one. I'll try to post pictures. The female does not stop calling him. Even though the male seems comfortable enough in the cage where I'm keeping him warm. From the looks of it though, it does seem like it is a respiratory infection.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

OK then he's going to need to see an avian vet ASAP as a tiel can go down-hill really fast (like once you notice the symptoms its pretty bad.) The calling is something that may stop after a couple days but right now she's calling for him because she's trying to find him and make sure he's OK (its called flock calling.) Hopefully he gets better soon!


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

roxy culver said:


> OK then he's going to need to see an avian vet ASAP as a tiel can go down-hill really fast (like once you notice the symptoms its pretty bad.) The calling is something that may stop after a couple days but right now she's calling for him because she's trying to find him and make sure he's OK (its called flock calling.) Hopefully he gets better soon!


Thanks. We covered the cage up and that seemed to help her quiet down.


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Did you take the bird to the Avian Vet? And you said you had pics but you haven't posted them yet.. can we see them?


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

Here they are. Sorry they aren't the best quality. 









Female (taken yesterday)








Male (taken 2 days ago)​


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

Both these birds are not looking good at all. They need to see an Avian Vet ASAP. The male more so than the female. But now. Get them to a Vet.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Neither one of the birds looks healthy, and they should both see a vet. Mention to the vet about the recent egg, and ask the vet for suggestions to discourage breeding right now.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

DyArianna said:


> Both these birds are not looking good at all. They need to see an Avian Vet ASAP. The male more so than the female. But now. Get them to a Vet.


The female doesn't look or act sick to me, but I'm taking both regardless tomorrow since I'm sure she's sick (even though it doesn't show). Thanks for the advice guys. Hopefully they get better; I hate seeing him like that. Even though I've had them for like 3 weeks, you get attached really fast .


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

The female looks like she is going light (thin) Since the beaks have that slight pinched/ridged look they are not eating as much as they should....what is their diet?


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## DyArianna (Aug 7, 2011)

What type of plant is that behind them in the pics?


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Sorry for all the questions. What do their droppings look like. Place3 clean newspaper or white paper towels under them to see what the current droppings look like. Below is what a normal dropping will look like (click for a larger view)


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

srtiels said:


> The female looks like she is going light (thin) Since the beaks have that slight pinched/ridged look they are not eating as much as they should....what is their diet?


Well, since I got her, she looks the same. It doesn't look like she's loosing weight per se. But they seem to be eating as usual. They eat seeds (the usual store type), spinach, lettuce, carrots (occasionally), and sometimes a little bit of apple. 

EDIT: And I'm trying to introduce other food. I tried giving them hard boiled eggs but they didn't touch it. My moms friend said she only gave them seeds and occasionally, she would throw in lettuce.



DyArianna said:


> What type of plant is that behind them in the pics?


It's a plastic plant...they wanted to bite it, but I moved it slightly to the side so they couldn't reach it.



srtiels said:


> Sorry for all the questions. What do their droppings look like. Place3 clean newspaper or white paper towels under them to see what the current droppings look like. Below is what a normal dropping will look like (click for a larger view)


The females look normal. The male's look normal but occasionally they will look like this deep black color and long an very thick.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

*occasionally they will look like this deep black color and long an very thick.*

The dark black color can be a sign of not enough food passing thru the digestive tract. By looking at his/their beaks they are not eating (may not like) much of what you are feeding them and can be slowly starving themselves. 

Also when the poop is dark the slower gut movement allows the intestines to absorb both nutrients and pathogens in the GI tract. If this goes on too long the inside wall of the intestines can deteriorate and start to bleed. 

To check if there is bleeding some of the dark droppings can be smeared on white paper, help up to a strong light. If a dark green then it is feces, and if a rust/brown color shows it could be slight bleeding in the upper GI tract.

All seed is not equal. ideally you would want to give a brand of seed that is plain with very little to no extra fillers iun it. By fillers, I mean bits of fruit, nuts, dried veggies, pellets, cereals etc. Keep the seed simple and plain. When a seed mix has lots of fillers there is very little seed, and over time a bird can very s-l-o-w-l-y suffer from malnutrion.


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## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

This thread should be helpful: http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=17680


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## green parakeet (Oct 20, 2011)

Does the female usaly have her eyes half closed like that? Because in a cockatiel that can be a sign of pain.


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## northernfog (Dec 14, 2010)

After seeing the pictures of your birds, I can't help but keep my mind on how the vet visit went. I am really happy you took them in so that you can treat them with the help they need. Please keep us posted on the condition of your birds. 

Sending hopes and prayers that they will be just fine your way!


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## bjknight93 (Nov 13, 2011)

Let us know how the vet visit goes/went. I followed this thread up until where pictures were asked for. Iagree neither look healthy. Both are quite puffed up and both have eyes closed or squinted...from the picture the female does look thin but the male could be the same way since his puffed feathers hide his shape.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

Hey guys. Sorry I hadn't responded to this thread, but I was so busy with school, I didn't have time to log on. I took them to the vet. Unfortunately, he said he wasn't likely to survive because he was in the last stages of his sickness. I told him that it had only been a couple of days since his symptoms had shown. He said that the unfortunate thing about birds is that they don't show until the very last stages. That was the worst thing he could say. Today, he passed away . It just sucks because this all happened in 7 days. Symptoms, vet, death. The thing is though, I don't know how to take him out of the cage, since it just happened. Will the female start calling again once she sees he's gone? That's the worst part...


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## northernfog (Dec 14, 2010)

Oh no!!! This is so sad!  I am so sorry for what has happened. 
How is the other bird, did you get her checked up as well?


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

I'm so sorry...did the vet say what killed him and whether the female was at risk? 

You can just take the body out. You can let her see it if you like, it'll help her accept that he's gone.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

northernfog said:


> Oh no!!! This is so sad!  I am so sorry for what has happened.
> How is the other bird, did you get her checked up as well?


I did. Thanks.



roxy culver said:


> I'm so sorry...did the vet say what killed him and whether the female was at risk?
> 
> You can just take the body out. You can let her see it if you like, it'll help her accept that he's gone.


It was a bacterial infection, he said. He said she was fine - LUCKILY. But he said her calcium was low and he gave her a vitamin shot of some sort. He also said to clean the cage and to bring her back if there's any signs that she's ill. 

I took the bird out and I made sure she saw it. She looked a little depressed for a while but doesn't seem to be calling out for him. She laid an egg 2 days ago, and as I'm typing this, she went back in the nest (the egg has a large crack, so it probably won't hatch). I wonder if she'll lay another. Maybe it will keep her distracted.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

You can repair the crack...with a piece of papertowel and clear nailpolish. Place the papertowel over the crack and paint over it. It will keep the egg viable if its fertile.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

roxy culver said:


> You can repair the crack...with a piece of papertowel and clear nailpolish. Place the papertowel over the crack and paint over it. It will keep the egg viable if its fertile.


Really, even if it's fairly large? Let me try. Thanks for the tip.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Yes because it seals the egg so the baby can develop. Good luck!


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

roxy culver said:


> Yes because it seals the egg so the baby can develop. Good luck!


So it doesn't look like that egg will survive since the crack turned into more of a puncture and she didn't sit on continuously (she left it there unattended for hours at a time). But, she laid another one today :]. From what I've read, they lay one every 2 days (one day yes one day no) but it's been 3 days since she laid the last one .


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

Every two days is only an average. Some lay every 36hrs, etc. If the egg is punctured you can remove it and just let her have the current one. She may not sit full time until the whole clutch has been laid.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

roxy culver said:


> Every two days is only an average. Some lay every 36hrs, etc. If the egg is punctured you can remove it and just let her have the current one. She may not sit full time until the whole clutch has been laid.


Okay, that's what I figured. But one more question, if she doesn't sit full time until she lays more eggs (so lets say she leaves them for for hours at a time and intermittently sits on them until she lays the full clutch), will the ones that she already would have had by then, will they still be able to hatch? Because I read that once she begins sitting on them, she can only leave them for a short while (around 30 minutes) before they die/aren't able to hatch. Also, thanks again for being so helpful.


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## roxy culver (May 27, 2010)

As long as she doesn't start incubating them full time and then get off of them for so long that they chill and die they should be fine. They can be viable for up to ten days if she doesn't start incubating them.


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## alexd (Feb 19, 2012)

I guess this is turning into a breeding thread now haha. But I just took the broken egg out. She didn't come out all day, so when she finally did, I took it out. It was starting to smell just a little, I guess because the paper and nail polish I covered it with, didn't fully stick. I also candled it just to make sure and it doesn't appear to be fertilized/growing. 

Here's the pics:

http://i41.tinypic.com/nx9v9h.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/6qju4p.jpg


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