# Dodgy Droppings



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Hi all, im new to this forum. So Hi to everyone! Just wanted an insight really, My 7 year old male Cock (Derek) is passing strange poohs, they have been fine up until today! It has seeds in it, full ones. However, i must add, in the last few days i introduced another Cock (4 months old) into the cage. Could this be due to the stress of it all, or could it be something else. He is normal in all other ways. My Hen (Missy) was PTS over a week ago now, they were never a real pair, could just about tolerate eachother, however there was no bullying, just silly squabbles if one got too close to the other (she was an older adult when i first got derek at 9 weeks old) They adjusted and got on ok. I lost her last week, it has been a traumatic time, however didnt want him alone, and didnt want another hen for a few reasons.Thanks in advance.


----------



## Renae (Feb 9, 2008)

From what I know a Cockatiel pooping whole seeds IS NOT normal - could be a bacterial infection.. but you are best off taking him to an Avian Vet ASAP to have him checked and diagnosed.

Edit: *If you notice any bits of seed or pellets, be worried. These symptoms could mean parasites, an intestinal infection, proventricular dilation, or a disease of the pancreas or other internal organs.*


----------



## Tielzilla (Mar 31, 2009)

nope that is not normal at all..you need to get him to an avian vet asap...please ask them to do gram stains and also blood work..INSIST ON IT


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Ive rang the vets, i have an appointment for tomorrow. I really hope hes going to be ok. Missy had to be PTS last week and the vet thought it to be stress from egg laying, it took everything out of her. She was just obsessed. She seemed fine one minute, then larargic and weak the next! Her pooh was normal though! I had no history of her or age, although she was definatley an older adult when i got her, and i had her for over 7 years. Im in bits.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Thanks for your replies peeps


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Hes been sleeping most of the afternoon and still is, ive seperated both birds for the moment.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

Stress from the loss of Missy and the new bird can causes PH changes in the body which creates an acidic environment in the gut. Increased acidity kills off the beneficial bacteria in the gut (digestive tract) This can cause a malabsoption of nutrients, and a passing of whole seeds/foods. Mnay times giving the bird probiotics (acidolpholus) on anything it will eat, and in the water can correct this within hours.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Many thanks for that info, i saw this information somewhere else too, so have now sent my husband to try and track some down. I have ordered some over the net also, but i need it now! Very intresting what you wrote. Thanks. Lets cross fingers and hope its just stress!


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

If your husband is out, try and have him pick up some Brewers Yeast (Powder, at a health food store) It is excellent for stress and when the droppings are also wet the body is losing the water soluble nutrients and the Brewers Yeast rapidly replentishes then.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Ive ordered some, by the time i got your message it was too late, i have ordered some, so will use it if necessary (hoping this will be sorted with probiotic) Thanks! x


----------



## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

Did you quarantine the new tiel? I would take both to the vet for a check up.


----------



## Tazzie (Dec 31, 2008)

I'm wondering if it is stress too, birds are like humans they can get stressed and depressed and grieve as well


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Possibly stress, but i didnt want to take any chances if you see what i mean. I took him this morning, he was fluffed up when i looked at him and was trying to sleep.The seed was also still in his pooh. Vet has kept him in (on my request) to tube feed him incase he looses anymore weight, and also to start him on the anitbiotic! I have to ring later and see how he is. They have taken a pooh sample, but wont get results until tomorrow. Will update asap.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

I rang the vets 2 hours ago, they tried to feed him this morning and he brought it all back up again...doesnt sound good, im in pieces. I wont know the results until tomorrow for yeast/fungal infection. Im trying to get prepared for the worse. I am so very very angry, hurt, heart ripped out etc etc. Dont know what to do with myself. Im going to ring them again in an hour.


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

(((HUGS))) I hope the vet can turn him around. Since he can't hold down foods you might ask the vet about Sub-Q fluid therapy. That will get something into him and also keep him hydrated.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

He still hadnt been fed when i last rang and they were closing, but they did say that they get fed before they all leave for the day, and someone comes and checks on them later on, but obviously they cant answer the phone to me! They have said he still has head tucked into feathers etc, im not expecting a dramatic recovery or anything, at all, i just wanted to hear something positive! Im going tomorrow morning for results and to see him. Please pray for him.  They are tube feeding him, and have told me he has been eating seed also, as he has some on his crop...that really tells me NOTHING! Vet said they would be feeding him a powder??? They also gave him an injection after he was sick to motivate his digestive system????


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

He is in my thoughts.

As to feeling seed in the crop...many tiels will store alot of food in the crop to carry them thru the night. Before it gets dark they will pack their crop and if there is food in the crop it can be felt between the fingers and the base of the crop feels like a bean-bag.

The powder would be the base of the formula that they would mix with water to tube feed him. It could be a special formula for deliberated birds, which may also be easier to digest.

I'm not sure what the shot would have been. If it was fluids done Sub-Q (under the skin) that will hydrate and get fluids into the intestines to get it moving. As long is the digestive tract is not moving then food in there goes bad, and breeds bacteria and this is then absorbed thru the intestinal walls and into the blood stream and organs...not good.

If there is still time before the vet closes maybe they can let you visit him. Sometimes that may help them seeing something familair. You can also check to make sure if they are giving him the same foods he is used to eating. Whenever I had a bird hospitalized I would bring in what they daily ate. It is less stress to them, than being presented with strange food.

((HUGS))


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

No idea, havnt had the chance to ask to be honest, its hard trying to get hold of a vet when ive rang, its only a small surgery with 2 rooms. The receptionist is useless! They closed hours ago. Im there first thing in the morning (its about half an hour drive away as its the only specialised Avian vet for miles. I do have a more local vet that i use for the dogs, but you must know what its like looking for good avian vets! Thanks for the hugggsss, i needed them! Have now moved Dennis from the conservatory into the main living room so he can get used to us more, and noise of the television etc etc, also dont want him alone without Derek. :-(


----------



## srtiels (May 1, 2009)

It is sooooo frustrating not getting answers. 


As a back-up...if your local vet for the dogs can consult with an avian vet over the phone that would help. Also, I have used local non-avian vets to have tests and cultures sent out. When they work with a lab they have to specufy species and the tests are done according to that species...thus a non-avian vet can use those tests for a course of treatment.

If your local vet is interested in working with birds there is an avian verterinary book written just for non-avain vets. I have one listed on my website (manual of Avian Practice) http://justcockatiels.weebly.com/availablefor-sale.html


----------



## Tielzilla (Mar 31, 2009)

oh honey I just read this how very worrying praying hard for him


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Just an update on Derek. I rang the vet before i went to pick him up (was told to by the receptionist yesterday) Anyway, they said his droppings were better, so looks like he could be responding to the treatment (Fingers crossed). He had brought the Harrisons recovery formula up a little since being on it, however they think it might have been due to a full crop!

They have given me Harrisons recovery formula and Baytril antibiotics, i am sure you have come across them before? Could you please tell me what they are used for? Also, are they good treatments for birds? He has lost 4 grams since he was weighed yesterday morning.


Brought him home, and his droppings do look much better, hes on the cage floor now fluffed up :-( Not a good sign i know. I have put him upsatirs in my room, hes used to the room, so wont be stressful. Hes still in the small cage. He is eating his seed, i have put probiotics in his water (asked the vet and they said it wouldnt be a problem) and have given him some apple. I have to tube feed him the Harrisons formula 3x pd and give antibiotics 2x pd. I am still waiting on the results of the faeces samples. They said they wont have them until this afternoon.


----------



## Renae (Feb 9, 2008)

Baytril antibiotics treats the respiratory system and digestive organs. 

Harrisons Recovery Formula provides an easily assimilated source of nutrients for ill avian patients (passerines and psittacines).

Indications:
* When anorexia has slowed gastrointestinal emptying time. Not for cases of illeus or stasis.
* As a dietary transition for recovering patients that have been on a seed diet and need nutritional support.
* Medical and surgical patients that are recovering from pansystemic failure and have progressed to a point where oral, easily digested diets are indicated.

I hope he's better soon - if you start seeing any symptoms make sure to ring the Avian Vet right away.. I don't know if he should still be fluffing up (might be a good idea to ring and ask) but give the antibiotics another few days to start working.


----------



## andreanne1422 (Jul 27, 2009)

I'm praying for your little guy! I hope he starts feeling better soon!


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Thanks so much guys. He has spent most of the morning on his perch, which is good. Hes eating and his dropping are looking abit better, however still passing seeds in them. Hes get more used to the tube feeding and antibiotics. Ive very much still got my fingers crossed.

The vet rang this AM and said the samples were back, he has bacteria and a little yeast in the droppings.They still dont know for definate what hes got, however, im just concerntarting on his weight and his progress on the meds for now. Hes lost 8 grams since Thursday! Due to weigh him today, even though i should have done it this morning, however, didnt want to stress him too much.

Will update when i have more news.


----------



## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

I hope he continues to do well. I read in your other post that he is on probiotics aswell. I thought that you should always finish the antibiotics first and then you can give probiotics after the antibiotic treatment


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Every vet will say differently! They said it was ok for me to still be giving it to him? But i have stopped it anyway, just incase He has been hospitalized since sunday, so we are just waiting to see an improvment. This really has had a MAJOR effect on my health and state of mind, i am PRAYING TO GOD he makes a recovery.


----------



## Mythara (Apr 9, 2009)

Have they diagnosed the problem yet?


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

No, but with help i think i have!


----------



## Kerry78 (May 25, 2009)

Oh dear im sorry to hear about the loss of your little girl 
I hope Derek gets better soon and that you will give lots of kisses and huddles when you get him home, your vets sound good except for the non negotiation part I haven't a clue where my nearest Avian is there 2x vet surgerys near me though phew ive had my Tiels fromMarch and haven't had any problems with them at all "Touches wood" I sorted out injured toes and bitten noses with Aloe Mists and TLC etc but nothing more!

please keep us all upto date with D's progress thinking of you Dear x


----------



## clawnz (May 28, 2009)

Clairey331 said:


> No, but with help i think i have!


Pray tell all!
I am so sorry for your Tiel that passed away.
I can understand how stressed you are about your other baby.
My fingers are crossed for you both.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

We suspect Derek has Megabac, it hasnt been diagnosed yet, however it is hard to get an accurate result in a fecal sample of this anyway. He was far too under weight to under go anymore tests. However, when leaving the vets on Thursday 29th when i picked him up from the vets he was a tiny 80grams, 9 days later he now weights 94grams. I am tube feeding him, adding potent brew and calivet. I am also giving him ACV in his drinking water. I must be doing something right for now. I just hope he keeps the weight on.


----------



## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

Poor guy, is he still on antibiotics?


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

No, i took him off them when i brought him home from the vets, they were doing nothing for him. He is alot perkier! He wasnt talking or whistling a week ago, he was just fluffed up at the bottom of the cage, he now wont shut up! Lol

Oh, i want more SPIKE u tube videos! Im sure EVERYONE else on here does too! x


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

Hes on the perches, only on the floor to eat, keeps flock calling me (hes upstairs in our bedroom) Everytime he hears any of the doors open he starts going mental for us! He talks to us everynight when we get into bed (after weve turned the lights off and hes covered up) Ive had a good cry every night, love him so much.


----------



## xxxSpikexxx (Jul 30, 2007)

It sounds like he is starting to feel better 



Clairey331 said:


> No, i took him off them when i brought him home from the vets, they were doing nothing for him. He is alot perkier! He wasnt talking or whistling a week ago, he was just fluffed up at the bottom of the cage, he now wont shut up! Lol
> 
> Oh, i want more SPIKE u tube videos! Im sure EVERYONE else on here does too! x


Ha ha, I will see what I can do


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

"See you in abit Spike" Lol.


----------



## Clairey331 (Oct 21, 2009)

UPDATE: After a terrible, terrible few months i managed to get Derek better up till now! He now weighs 101 grams! He was just 79grams at his lowest. No seeds in pooh, and is his usually happy self! He had Avian Gastric yeast. The vets couldnt diagnose so with alot of research i firgured it out and treated myself.

I have to admit i didnt post, as i couldnt be bothered looking at any hate mail i would have recieved because i treated him myself.

Thanks to all of you that helped me...you know who you are.

I will post pictures when i can!


----------



## fluoro.black (Nov 5, 2009)

Aww congrats! Must have been a few hard months, but I'm glad you looked after him so well  and that it had a positive result .


----------

